About Eulas

#1 Nowadays I actually read them word for word.

There's two main factors in this:
1) I'm a linux user. I don't actually see very many eulas, and I already know the licenses for pretty much all the software that I use inside out anyway. I also rarely install sofware.
2) When the SCO debacle began, I suddenly realised that this stuff is important.

Before SCO, all I ever saw was a bunch of slashdot-standard ranting on the topic, which I duly ignored. But since groklaw and SCO, I've realised that it's actually *important*.

Nowadays, I consider the license to software [which includes the EULA] to be of pivotal importance to me. Can I use it as I want? If not, then I need to find some other software. That's all there is to it.

I also pathologically refuse to pirate software, music, movies, etc...

I'm not a laywer, so I may well miss things from time to time, but overall I feel that I'm doing better for it.


What boggles my mind, to be honest, is that you're licensing source for a closed-source project. I mean, come on, kids. Y'all better read that thing at least once, since this isn't your normal winzip or mIRC messing about, you know? The winzip EULA... well, whatever. But a EULA for SOURCE CODE? Please, think, kids.


Bleh. I steadfastly didn't comment on the other threads, but since I've started, I'll just state my case and be done with it:
COME BLOODY ON.
1) It's in the EULA. You sure as sh*t should have read the simple, surprisingly-non-legalese EULA for licensing source code. It's less than a page, how hard can it be?
2) You had to agree to said EULA
3) Everyone has logos at the start, that may not reflect their branding. If nothing else, this whole thing is a non-issue, anyway.
4) If you don't like it, that's what the 300 USD license is for. I found it in two minutes on the GG site.

Mostly I didn't comment in the other threads because I simply can't believe that anyone, especially someone intelligent enough to be poking C++ code, is retarded enough that this would be an issue.

Gary (-;

#2 @Gary: Had to laugh after reading your post because it's similar to a short one I just (finally) left on that "other" thread. Didn't want to, but finally did. Agree with everything you said.

@Ray: Having been in the computer business since the mid 70's, I've learned to read EULA's all the way through, with the exception of some game demos I look at. I always want to know what my rights and limitations are with a piece of software. I also like to check the top and bottom of the cereal box - never know.

Terry

#3 If I ever get married I'm going to have her sign an EULA along with the marraige license. Naturally she'll skim it and I'll get away with all kinds of stuff and she won't have any recourse. "Should've read the EULA, honey!"

#4 @Josh: That was great. =)

#5 Josh... you obviously have a lot to learn about wives...hahahaha

#6 Yeh, women actually read the fine print and then they proceed on making hidden clauses themselves :)

#7 No, no, no, no! You guys are all wrong!

Women don't read the fine print, they write the fine print. It's us who have to ensure we read it well! :)

- Melv.

#8 That's one EULA I'm happily bound to. And it's kind of fun finding out about some of the hidden clauses.

#9 Thats what you say now, just wait untill their ovaries stop keeping them calm. I'm now single...... Blessedly.

#10 I admit I only read it if I plan on doing something commercial with the product.

#11 I was just going to post a question about EULAs, and since this thread is already here...

I was reading about reverse engineering recently, and then I started wondering about games. What if you buy a game, but you don't agree to the EULA or install the game? Of course copyright and trademark law and such applies, but clearly the EULA doesn't apply right? I was reading one EULA which stated that failing to agree with it meant that the reader must return the product to the store. LOL, what a crock. I'm no lawyer but I do know that someone must agree to a EULA to be bound by it. If I buy a game, and I choose not to agree to the EULA (or install the game), I still own the cd I just paid for. Of course, I can't just do anything I want with it, but there's a lot of room between "do anything I want with it" and "according to this EULA [which you haven't agreed to yet], you are legally required to return the game if you don't agree to this EULA." Lawyers are funny when they try to get away with nonsense like that.

I guess there was a question in there somewhere. :)

#12 You own the physical media, not the license to do anything with the content on the media. You're arguing two different things (as are they). The purpose of "returning the media" is to remove the content from your hands, not to remove the media from your hands. Content is an intangible entity that people buy all the time, but we get confused when we think of not owning something tangible. We're a culture of tactile consumers, but we're moving into an intangible area in terms of property rights.

#13 Please don't hit refresh on the url you submitted your post on!

#14 ...and go back and delete your old posts by clicking on the garbage can icon.

#15 Nowadays, there's a sticker on the shrinkwrap that says "Removing this shrinkwrap [or breaking this seal, in some cases] constitutes acceptance of the EULA." Never mind that the EULA is inside the box, and the only way you can get to it to read it is ... you guessed it. Nevertheless, once you remove the shrinkwrap, break the seal or open the box, you've agreed to it.

Oh, by the way, reading this far constitutes acceptance of my EULA. Now you're not allowed to copy, modify or reverse-engineer anything I've said. Gotcha gotcha gotcha!

#16 As soon as you install something you have agreed to it. the reason being that the eula is either presented in the packaging or loaded during the install process.

Quote: I'm no lawyer but I do know that someone must agree to a EULA to be bound by it

That's not true at all. If you do not agree to the Eula, you are not allowed to use it, period.
It is a legally binding agreement.

If you buy a product, you pretty much know your gettin a eula. So I really don't understand your argument.

#17 PS stop refreshing! you have posted the same post 8 times now

#18 Err, that seems like a rather egregious bug (especially since they don't show up in my browser). I don't like to be emailed replies, so I refresh. I'll stop doing it now.

#19 Whoah, weird, all these other new posts just showed up when I clicked the "go" button instead of refresh. Sorry about that folks.

#20

Quote:As soon as you install something you have agreed to it. the reason being that the eula is either presented in the packaging or loaded during the install process.

I adressed this in my original post.

Quote:Nowadays, there's a sticker on the shrinkwrap that says "Removing this shrinkwrap [or breaking this seal, in some cases] constitutes acceptance of the EULA." Never mind that the EULA is inside the box, and the only way you can get to it to read it is ... you guessed it. Nevertheless, once you remove the shrinkwrap, break the seal or open the box, you've agreed to it.

Fat chance of that holding up in court.

Quote:That's not true at all. If you do not agree to the Eula, you are not allowed to use it, period.
It is a legally binding agreement.

When I buy a shrinkwrapped game cd, I have agreed only to give the vendor $x and to receive a shrinkwrapped game cd. No EULA has been agreed to.

Quote:If you buy a product, you pretty much know your gettin a eula. So I really don't understand your argument.

We're talking about legalities here, "you pretty much know" ain't cuttin' it.

edit: of course, I could be wrong here - I'll accept a legal precedent that argues otherwise.