Submitting a game to GarageGames

#1 We are going to be releasing some free games. What is it about?

#2 Please don't send a design document. We don't have time to look at it.

#3

Quote:Please don't send a design document. We don't have time to look at it.

Lol thats amusing.

I assume though that you are referring to an unsolicited design document. When the time comes to speak with you all about publishing, i'd imagine you will want to read the design document before deciding? Or do you just want to see a nice demo? Are you agreeable to signing an NDA first? I Ask because some publishers refuse to sign an NDA, and I understand thier reasonings for doing so. It is simmiliar to that a movie studio won't sign a script release.

Anyway i'm just curious. We're not there yet either, but we're shooting hard for an internal demo within 3 months. 6 months on paper, but I want it done before then :)

What would be the "proper" way to approach you guys when the time comes? Is there a certain email we should drop a message to?

#4 Probably the best approach would be to contact Jay or Jeff once you have a solid demo of some sort to show. Another excellent way to get noticed would be to bring a cool demo to IGC.

#5 I have things in place to hopefully bring Mayhem to GDC next year. That will coincide pretty close to the projected launch time for the game. As for IGC, I need to do some more research on it I guess. I had thought it was this month or next, but I just looked it up and it was in October last year. Assuming i'm looking at the right convention.

Is this it here?
http://www.indiegamescon.com/

#6 Oct 8-10 is our window.

#7 We won't sign an NDA. As a publisher, you simply cannot tie up potential future deals by looking at something that is not complete. Most publishers have you sign something that is the opposite of an NDA. This publisher "look" document basically says something like we have already thought of nearly every game design that can be made or we will eventually think of that design.

As much as we want to help people, I kind of have to agree with this. I have been making games so long that I feel ideas are nearly worthless. Implementation is everything. I have a hundred ideas that I will never get around to making. Designs are not much more than fleshed out ideas.

GG is set up to look at completed or nearly completed products. We have helped some people during the development phase, but mostly we don't have the time.

If you don't need an NDA signed, and want to give a general idea of what you are working on, I can give you a very quick read on whether GG would be interested when the project is done. Of course, there are never any guarantees because I don't know if you will do a good job implementing what may be a good idea.

For instance, the FPS taking place in a real city. The odds are that this idea will not make it. Any FPS game in today's market has huge expectations, and it will need to be carefully developed in order to even be worth it to release as a free game.

-Jeff Tunnell GG

#8 Thanks Ben. I'm sure as the time approaches that website will be updated for 2004's information. Since IGC is MUCH cheaper than GDC, I think I can loosly plan on being there in some form or another. I don't really know much about IGC though. Is there an exhibition floor like GDC or is it more basic "bring a laptop with a cool demo" :) If there is an exhibition floor what sort of costs would we be looking at to setup a booth for a demo?

#9

Quote:We won't sign an NDA. As a publisher, you simply cannot tie up potential future deals by looking at something that is not complete. Most publishers have you sign something that is the opposite of an NDA. This publisher "look" document basically says something like we have already thought of nearly every game design that can be made or we will eventually think of that design.

Yep I figured as much. That is pretty standard for publishers, but I just wanted to clarify.

Quote:GG is set up to look at completed or nearly completed products. We have helped some people during the development phase, but mostly we don't have the time.

Understandable, and we don't expect anything to happen before the product is finished or demoable. I've been in this business in one form or another since 1993 and I know its all about what you physically have, not what you want or are promising. However, this is my first go around from the role of studio owner, and lead design, so theres going to be rough spots in my knowledge.

Quote:If you don't need an NDA signed, and want to give a general idea of what you are working on, I can give you a very quick read on whether GG would be interested when the project is done. Of course, there are never any guarantees because I don't know if you will do a good job implementing what may be a good idea.

To be perfectly honest, i'd rather hold off until we have a demo. It isn't that I doin't trust GG, its that i'd hate for you to read it then come back and say "dog crap!". That would be a huge emotional blow to me. At least if we've built it already and THEN you say dog crap, we've still built it.

#10 Just curious, but is GarageGames only looking for 3D games? (ie: Using 3d game engines, Torque or not.)

I have a Torque project that's kind-of in progress, but currently a 2D game that I want to release first.

I'm considering approachign GG about this, but not sure if you guys/gals are looking for a 2D scrolling shooter kind of game to add to your lineup.

#11 GG is just looking for FUN games. A new twist is that we probably won't publish a game unless it is cross platform.

2D scrolling shooters are tough. Not many people want to pay for them any more. A Mario like side scroller... maybe, but a standard shooter will really have to be great to rise above the cruft and all of the free stuff floating around.

-Jeff Tunnell GG

#12 Wouldn't that make integrating Novodex or Tokamak into the physics workflow work against a developer that wants to publish with GG? Of course, ODE wouldn't be a problem in that scenario, though.

While Open GL support is on the plate for TSE, projects that include it in their workflow will initially be available only for Windows (with shaders) since it makes use of DirectX. At least as I understand it now from the topics I've seen.

It won't affect my project since I'm working on the Windows/Linux versions first since I can't afford a dual G5 as of yet, and the physics for my shooter do not need to be extravagant. Plus, TSE wouldn't change the gameplay regardless.

I just thought I'd field some questions that I've seen people asking lately about Novodex and TSE. Especially in relation to publishing with GG if the cross-platform compatability is halted by licensing or shader availability (though I know that TSE will be cross-platform in the future).

My project's in extreme-pre-alpha state where I'm working out the gameplay in the engine right now. And since it's a pattern-based top-down shooter combined with a Sin and Punishment-esque rail-shooter, it's not the most innovative type of game out there. So I doubt it'd be on the GG publishing plate in the future regardless. Plus, I need to work on content creation now that I have a lot of the camera and gameplay tweaks worked out.

I just thought I'd ask for a little more clarification, even if it won't do much for my project (since it's a rather simple project that I work on when I'm not trying to do film or keep my cushy university job). It may help others with more ambitious products than my own.

#13 It's mostly cross platform. I'm using a Mac/Linux/Win32 graphics/sound library right now. The code will require a little banging to make it work under other OSes, but this wouldn't be any sort of major re-write as the engine is plain ANSI C.

Well, I won't try to claim the game is fun or above-the-rest, because who am I to judge? I'll just finish the demo and give it to you guys to try out. :)

Thanks for the reply, though. Now, back to regularly scheduled thread...Sorry for the hijack.

#14 Hmm.. this news that cross-platform will be required makes me squirm a little. The details are lacking, I realize, but I'll explain my concern. I don't have access to Mac. I don't have the resources to buy a Mac (student with loans, soon-to-be-married, etc.). I have a game that I think will be very fun... as long as I implement it correctly (I whole-heartedly agree with Jeff on this). It will be in Torque, so the conversions to make it cross-platform are nearly nonexistent (so I hear). The only thing is, you need a Mac to compile it on. I could make it available for Linux, though I wasn't planning on it so much, because Linux only seems to work sometimes. That said, I am writing this in Linux :) I'm a one-man-band, so my time and resources are very very limited, so I'd rather not have to support games on platforms that are volatile.
Now that I've expressed my concern, what are the details for this cross-platform requirement?

#15 What about selling off your mac/linux versions of your game if you don't feel like you can do the support? The buyer compiles the builds and supports those platforms that you feel you can't support. Just an idea. It complicates things as far as legalitites and money swapping but maybe could be an option.

Any thoughts?

#16 The details are that we want games on more than the WIN platform. We have give you the tools, you need to figure it out. As easy as it is, if you make a game we are interested in, I know you can get it done by community members.

Tennis Critters still has not been put on the MAC, and we can't get through to the author. He has responded once, but we can't get it to happen. If we had a Mac version, TC could have been one of our biggest sellers.

Some day I will do a .plan on this, but for now don't worry, just make a great game.

-Jeff Tunnell GG

#17 Thanks, Jeff. Sounds great. I just thought I'd field that question a bit since I'd seen it come up in the Novodex and TSE topics. It has little impact for me since 1.2 works for my project nearly right out of the box with minor camera and control tweaking. The vast majority of my time has been and will be spent on content creation.

I'm working with Linux and Windows (because those are what I have), but am saving for a dual G5, Final Cut Pro, and (in the far future since it costs as much as the G5 itself) Shake. Well, if I stop spending money on making shorts, I'll be saving, that is.

#18 You could get someone else from the community to port your game to Mac for you. Paul Danna did the Mac and Linux ports of Produce Panic for us (and I believe he did some other games too). I'm sure he (or someone else) would be happy to port your game in exchange for a percentage of sales or money or something.

#19 Hmmm. I smell a business opportunity here.

I have hardware and software for development and testing of games using torque on PC's, Macs, and Linux boxes. And I would be willing to consider doing ports of games from one platform to another. The game would have to be essentially complete on one platform and ready to move to another one I don't have time to do a lot of development and debugging work on somebody else's half-done game.

The service could be done either as a fee for porting or as a percentage of the sales on that platform. So, you can decide if you want to keep the profits and pay up front, or have me take the risk by getting a percentage of the returns.

If the service began to take off, their might also be room to hire in some additonal programmers to give a few new people a chance "to get their feet wet" in the game industry.

Suggestions and feedback?

#20 A 'porting' service would probably do pretty well. Not enough to quit your day job, but I'll bet you could make enough to get the boat rebuilt for the summer.