Game Development Community

dev|Pro Game Development Curriculum

The New Magic Word

by Brett Seyler · 11/12/2009 (4:02 pm) · 289 comments

68.233.5.139/~transfer/brett/oprah-1.pngLast week, Epic Games made a pretty big splash announcing the "UDK" or Unreal Development Kit. UDK is based on the *very expensive* Unreal Engine 3, the most dominant game engine in the big budget console games space. There's been a lot of hyperbolic talk about how this is an "end of days" development for Torque and our friendly Copenhagen competitors, Unity. I want to take a while here to talk about what I think this means for Torque and where we fit in the competitive landscape.

When the announcement showed up, of course I immediately wanted to dig in and find out what was up. I took some time and looked at the license on the UDK site. Many people here downloaded the UDK to play around with it and see what was what. It turns out that the UDK is basically an up to date set of editors for Unreal Engine 3. There's no source code provided. Instead, as with modding, you can do scripting with Epic's Unrealscript. You can package your project for Windows only. There are docs online, but otherwise no dedicated support. So let's be clear. This is NOT Unreal Engine 3. That would kill a huge source of revenue (supported, source code licensing for PC and consoles) for Epic. It *is* a well-tested, rich set of editors for making stuff based on UE3 games or projects.

What's the license like for this? Well, Epic is slapping up the word FREE everywhere and who doesn't love something for FREE right? It's a magic word. The UDK website grants you (for free) a license to make non-commercial works. If you want to make money, or benefit indirectly somehow from using the UDK (think making a demo to advertise or sell something else or a company who wants to train employees with a simulation), you have to pay. The terms of making something commercial with the UDK are actually a bit murky because Epic does not post the license on their site or allow you to purchase a commercial license on thier site. Instead, they give you an email address to hit up and describe the terms of the license structure.

Option A: You benefit (somehow) from using and distributing UDK projects, but there's no revenue. You can pay $2500 / seat annually for this use of the UDK.

Option B: You sell, advertise on, or somehow directly or indirectly, generate revenue from a project made with UDK. You pay $99 up front and you give up 25% of all revenues exceeding $5000 on that project.

68.233.5.139/~transfer/brett/ut3.pngPretty straightforward options! It would be nice to see the license, but assuming it's reasonable, sounds like a pretty fair deal. So what's the catch? How does Epic make money from this? They don't. Not really. This is a loss leader and an evangelism play and it really doesn't cost them much of anything to do. For years you've been able to spend $60 on Unreal Tournament, Gears of War, or other Unreal titles and use the provided editors to modify the game. You can do a lot with mods and people have created really cool stuff. Epic never monetized this practice before. Instead, they used it as a way to create longer tail sales for their games and to recruit new talent from the modder community. By offering the "UDK," Epic is taking the next step by letting people distribute Unreal mods without requiring ownership of the modded Unreal game.

In addition to formalizing what they've always done with the mod communities built around Unreal, Epic is likely to heavily monetize the inevitable step from UDK --> UE3. This is no small step and it will cost small teams as much as Epic can wring out of them, in addition to the 25% royalties they are already on the hook for. My guess is that it will be case by case, but it's guaranteed that most teams will run into barriers not having access to the engine source, just as they do with other binary-only engines.


I'm not going to dismiss this move by Epic. It matters. Here's why...


#1: It's Epic (no pun intended). They are an absolute behemoth in the games industry. They've absolutely demolished all competitors in the AAA console engine space for the last 5 years, essentially since EA acquired Criterion, makers of Renderware, and stopped licensing it to 3rd parties. They have an established business selling very expensive (think 6-7 figures, depending on the royalty rate) licenses for big budget console games and now, they've decided they want indies, amateurs, and hobbyists to use their product too. That's a pretty decent market disturbance.

#2: It's validation. When I wrote about the hyper-competitive, well-served big budget AAA space while discussing the pricing and licensing of Torque 3D back in January, I noted that the AAA middleware market hasn't grown much in the last decade and it continues to be a pretty fixed size market. At the same time, the space Torque and Unity occupy (better accessibility and opportunity via lower licensing costs and more attractive platforms) has grown tremendously. This community here grows by hundreds of users every week. A larger portion of the games industry as a whole is moving away from stagnant AAA console games and targeting super-fast growing platforms like the iPhone, Facebook, and yes, even just regular PC online games. Clearly Epic must see something they like in these markets. They missed the boat on the Wii and they are probably struggling to maintain (let alone grow) revenues in the AAA console space. I'm not sure if this will be a long-lasting commitment on Epic's part, or simply a way to maximize the value of their current tech while the new stuff (UE4) is what they're going to start pushing to high-end clients, right around the corner. Regardless, validation is nice.

#3: Now everyone can see behind the "AAA" curtain. We've been telling you for years that Torque is top-notch technology. We've said "it's documented up to, and in many cases well beyond the industry standard." Without being able to look at engines like Unreal, that's been a hard claim for you guys to verify. Now you can. Have a look at UDK. Look at the tools. Look at the docs. Test out the support. We think you'll find that Torque 3D stacks up very well in comparison, and all without the licensing burden of big royalties or high-cost access to source. Putting aside source though, it's worth answering the question:

What does Torque currently do better than Unreal?


Rendering - Torque is the first affordable engine with a deferred renderer. You have real-time dynamic lighting and shadows. You can have thousands of dynamic point lights in a scene at almost no hit to performance. You can't do this in Unreal. Torque's Light Pre-pass rendering is the standard for the current era of hardware. CryEngine uses it as do many of the best looking games on the market.

static.garagegames.com/static/pg/productpages/torque-3d/overview_1.jpg

Contrast this with Unreal, which uses a years old forward renderer that does not allow for global dynamic lighting or shadows. In fact, UE3 does not support more than one dynamic light casting shadows on the same object. It will switch shadows automatically to the nearest light. A directional light will allways switch off any light's shadows. With Unreal, all global illumination is baked. Everything you can do in Unreal, you can do with pureLIGHT in Torque 3D, but with Torque, you can combine dynamic global lighting and shadows with beautfully baked static lightmaps that give you realtime iterative results, not an hours long, black box baking process. Looking ahead, we'll probably be the first affordable engine with DX11 support, and I doubt you're going to see that from Unreal until UE4, likely a couple years away from public licensing, at least.

Terrain (editing AND fidelity) - Definitely test out the UDK terrain editors next to Torque 3D's. The UDK terrain tools are several generations behind us. In Torque 3D, you get much nicer terrain fidelity as well. It takes the right artwork to show this (which you'll see with Pacific Demo here in a few weeks), but the advantage for Torque is clear.

high-fi-terrain-880


Networking - Out of the box, Torque 3D will do things that you'll never get UDK to do without source code access and a LOT of work. It's as simple as that.

Platform support - Capable deployment to OSX machines is increasing a very important component to success for small teams. Torque 3D offers a path to every major platform out there (Windows, Mac, Web, Wii, Xbox 360, iPhone, with PS3 and PSP in the works).

static.garagegames.com/static/pg/productpages/torque-3d/overview_5.jpg

static.garagegames.com/static/pg/productpages/torque-3d/worldeditor_2.jpgSpecial purpose tools. - The road and river tools are just the beginning, but there's a lot more coming in 1.1 and 1.2 that you haven't seen before and which you definitely won't find in UDK.

Community resources, add-ons, and extensions. This is such a talent-rich and generous community. We do our very best not to take your contributions for granted. Rather, a major focus, particularly on this website in the next year, will be adding features that make the surfacing, sharing, and vetting of community resources and project much easier and much more powerful. There's really a lot we can do here and you're going to see constant improvement.


Now, UDK has some things not currently in Torque in it's favor as well. Nice features like nav meshes for AI, improved animation tools, etc. are all on our roadmap, but not yet in Torque 3D, so we've still got plenty of work ahead of us to keep up and stay competitive.

We want to take Torque much further, allowing developers to unlock opportunities on the best emerging platforms. That's going to take continued work and investment in the product by us, but we run a pretty lean operation, we reinvest nearly every dollar you spend with us back into product development, and we are moving *super* fast.

'FREE' might just be the new SSAO


We realize that staying ahead of the curve on technology is just part of the equation. The licensing model we choose is important and we're paying attention to all this FREE stuff as much as the rest of you. We want to offer something at a very accessible price, or perhaps for FREE as a good entry to learning and using Torque 3D. Currently, our free option is a demo, limited by the number of objects you can place in your scene. This obviously isn't useful to create an entire game, but it does give you a good feel for what Torque 3D's tool set can do, given that it's not feature limited in any way other than not including the source code.

By comparison, UDK also gives you everything for free, no features limited by the free version other than the source code, but you cannot use it to make anything commercial without payment. The cost, at minimum, is $99 + 25% of your revenues (after $5k total). Unity strips a great deal of their features out of their free version. These can drastically handicap development for some teams, but there's no reason why you couldn't finish some games with it either. The license is liberal, so it's a good stepping stone to make your first game, solo, if you're willing to live with some of the feature limitations.


68.233.5.139/~transfer/brett/torque-free_compare.png


So where does Torque 3D fit in all of this? Our "Professional" version, which includes source code, access to beta builds, private forums, etc is just $1000 / seat. We don't currently have an option between this and our free demo, but we want one. I think the recent developments by Unity and Epic and all the new developers trying their hand at 3D games warrants a low-priced option for Torque 3D, as well.

At the end of September, when we released Torque 3D 1.0, I included a poll contemplating an full-featured, binary-only version of Torque 3D to go for $500 / seat. Though the results were overwhelmingly in favor of this option, I think we can do better. In the past, I've been really happy with the feedback you've given us making decisions like this, so I want to enlist your help again.

What should we do?
What would you be happy with?
What do you think would be best for the community the future of the product?
Do we want a more elite, experienced community of programmers here?
Do we want to create a more balanced mix of great artists too?

I have my instincts on these questions, and we've discussed them a great deal internally, but I've always come back to this community as one of the big reasons to choose Torque for a new developer. It's one of kind and I want to keep it together and help it grow as much as possible. That won't happen if we don't have a competitive offering in Torque. This means we need enough income to feed the developers and keep the product blazing ahead full speed. But at the same time, if every new beginner cuts their teeth on UDK or Unity because they have viable free option and Torque doesn't, well, I don't like the position that puts us in for the long run either.

So please, let us know what you think! I promise I'll listen and weigh all feedback carefully. I hope to make a decision on this by the end of the month, so let fly with the suggestions and opinions. It's all welcome.

About the author

Since 2007, I've done my best to steer Torque's development and brand toward the best opportunities in games middleware.

#81
11/13/2009 (10:13 am)
Let the sillyness ensue!
#82
11/13/2009 (10:14 am)
Let the sillyness ensue!
(already posted once, but it went to that magical invisible half-page)

//Edit: Oh, it appeared after this post was made. wild!

...Now let the doubled sillyness ensue!
#83
11/13/2009 (10:33 am)
I haven't had the cash to upgrade to full source and I'd imagine that I wouldn't have the time or talent to delve into it:) But I would appreciate an option without source. To me the perfect price point for a source-less artist version would be $299.

At the moment, I get the feeling that the UDK is a better option for artists that want to build exhibits of their capability than Torque 3D. A lower cost option would cushion this. Without this lower cost option - the loss of even one talented artist is a serious blow. The engine needs great artists to showcase its capabilities.

I've toyed with UDK. I think it's neat (read very mature and cool) but I'd also like paths to publishing if I decided to go that way that didn't attach royalty strings. It's tough to compare an engine that has so many successful titles attached to it and dumps a significant amount of licensing revenue back into pipeline with Torque. It's not apples to apples.

But at the same time you can't compare the soul of the organizations that build the tools, nor the communities that are attached. It's not apples to apples.

My 2c.
#84
11/13/2009 (10:42 am)
UDK wants $100 + 25% of your game's revenue. The (extreme) royalty, lack of Mac support (which can make up nearly 50% of sales for indie games), and with no source access you're left to work entirely in UnrealScript which is very domain specific and SLOW. Also, Epic is just getting started in this and their focus is clearly not indie developers... it is pimping Unreal in education.

(So, for people looking to make a living making indie games, I would certainly look at UDK, but carefully consider if UnrealScript does everything you need, the revenue consequences of the royalty, and not being able to ship on Mac)

Unity wants $1500 per seat for the "Pro" version of their engine without the flexibility of having source access. I have some issues with Unity but for the most part it is a good engine, just keep in mind that if you end up needing anything, the "Free" price point kind of limits your voice... and you're looking at some major expense at $1500 a pop for Pro.

I'm under NDA regarding Torque 3D, so I can't say everything that I want to say. But, a full source license at $1000 with no royalty is a steal. (If that isn't clear for anyone today, as we continue to move forward it surely will be). There is also a lower entry point being worked out...

I registered my first GG account on August 9th, 2001. In that 8 years, there hasn't been a week I haven't logged into the site. There has been so much change, some good, some maybe not so good, but in the end I have seen every (major) issue get addressed.

When I first "met" Brett on the phone, we ended up hashing on stuff for 3 hours. I am *really* glad that Brett is on this stuff, he has very good (and level headed) vision... and... he... is... open... to... ideas. I know for a fact that none of this discussion goes unheard, which is VERY open and honest compared to what you get in competitors (very weak) forums.

... and on that note, just check out what a premium GG has placed on community with the site. Is it perfect? Nope. But it sure beats the hell out of some crappy forums. In the end, this COMMUNITY is what we make it... and if 80%+ of the posts are any indication, some truly excellent developers agree.

#85
11/13/2009 (11:23 am)
I would love to see level streaming (that's one reason I decided to download Unity), remove the overhead of client-server architecture for single-player games, and genre kits (can we can a list of what GG is thinking).
#86
11/13/2009 (11:39 am)
I don't have a problem with the price for an AAA engine at all. The problem is everytime I buy a different engine I have to buy the add-ons.
If I but T3D I'd have to buy Pure Light for another $500. By time I did this the T3D now cost me $1500 and for the upgrade from TGEA its $1205.

I think extra tools that make the engine better should be added in w/ the price. To charge for artwork/effects is one thing, but not for tools that go into the engine.

My biggest problem with last engines were the Engine kept getting updated, while everything else was left on the back burner. All of the kits were left behind. I think if GG going to sell something everything should work that goes into it. I bought the RTS kit it took over year to get updated to the latest version of TGE and still doesn't work with TGEA without some serious modification.

I think if someone want to sell a tool that goes into the engine that make it better GG should offer them a price, they can take it or leave it.
#87
11/13/2009 (12:02 pm)
The biggest hangup for me working with T3D is that I can't distribute the binary version to anyone who wants to help me. We have artists and worldbuilders on our team helping build our game, and I'd like to move to T3D but all of those people can't afford the $1000 required just to use the tools, nor can they really even *justify* it.

I would really like to see T3D licensing be amended to at least allow each Professional license X number of Binary-only licenses, because right now forcing everyone to pay $1000 to use the engine is actually *preventing* me from using it on more projects.
#88
11/13/2009 (12:09 pm)
My 1 cent to support GG :)
Old lesson from service price vs meat price.
Nowadays meat is much cheaper than service. There are so many free stuff around Orge, Irrilitch, Bullet...
Games are going to be free to play.So why not game engine. The only thing will never be free is I will work for you free (sorry that's always true).
So premium service is the way to go. I hate GG advertising, but I do love its buit in quality in the engine.

1) Robust Editor + Cool Video Tutorial for newbie ( look at gamespot video review, let make it cool whenever you hear torqueeeee videooooo tutorialllllllll...) need to kick our friendly Unity's ass.
2) Source code as cheap price for indie, i miss the 99 USD: for hobyist, small team with free community forum. They will payback like what most of us are doing now.
3) source code + premium service 1000$: this is important. Hire good torque developer from indie to help to support the premium service ( good student no money :) ). Think about it as a service: how we can help the game team to deliver their game as soon as possible as a unbeatable price. They need to integrate physics: 1 week, they need AI 1 week, they need art work for this for that....3 days...:). This will answer the question how long can I ship a game with Torque. If I want to ship it in 3 months and willing to pay the price for 3 months, GG task is help me to ship it in 3 months :). GG dont have to do it, but GG can temporarily employ some of GG community members, and they are huge in number, arent they?.
Service provider not engine provider any more :D.
Sorry my crazy idea.




#89
11/13/2009 (12:26 pm)
Quote:
Wow better rendering then the Unreal engine. Maybe on paper? I haven't seen a scene anything like in UT3 in T3D and what I have seen doesn't suggest to me it could run as fast.

For pure real-time rendering and lighting, T3D has a much better rendering engine than UE3. UT3 and most games made with UE3 use mostly baked lighting combined with some shader effects, which can be made to look much better than any real-time lighting with enough artist time. And of course, when you have a multi-million dollar budget, you can get a lot of top-notch artist time.

Things like unlimited dynamic lights and many lights casting shadows on the same objects are nice from a technical standpoint, but in reality the difference is usually negligible from the standpoint of the end users. Who has time to count the lights and shadows when you're fragging? Plus baked shadows can use as much time as you want to get them perfectly soft, while the real-time shadows will always look a little suspect, at least on current hardware.

On the other hand, the rendering system in T3D is HUGE for indie developers, because we don't have multi-million dollar budgets to throw at artists to create the perfect pre-lit scene. We can spend less time on lighting, and more time on content, which will look fairly comparable at least, and consume less resources with every change. And then we have the option of using baked lighting via pureLight where we think we absolutely need it.


Quote:
I think if someone want to sell a tool that goes into the engine that make it better GG should offer them a price, they can take it or leave it.

If you're suggesting what I think you are, that is a horrible idea. Third parties should not be able to create tools and sell them on their own, just because you don't want to spend extra on them? Pretty ridiculous.
#90
11/13/2009 (12:31 pm)
Brett your posts are always awesome. I have been very pleased with your particular communication on T3D development. And this community is the best I've seen.

(1) Add-Ons
I tend to agree with Morrie...to a degree. Perhaps the community should be able to kick the tires and vote on which tool add. The freedom to sell add-ons should always be available. Personally I think the Yack Pack should be integrated into stock T3D as a feature tool; since the original company washed their hands on support and upgrades and the official supported Torque products have retired.

(2) Docs
The docs are excellent on the material they cover. Why not recruit some experts out of the community to further push the doc content?

(3) "Free"
Dr. Brett's Wonder Enginelixer just $199. Josh nailed it, Epic is making a play at the education ranks. I spoke to someone who heads up game design in secondary education who chose Unity because it "seemed more accessible to the student budget". We spent the next 15-minutes going over some of the points in this post and comments. Education has coder (source) and artist students working as a team on a single project.
#91
11/13/2009 (12:35 pm)
It's worth noting that Leadwerks uses a traditional deferred rendering engine, while Torque3D uses a pre-pass renderer. While they are both deferred rendering, the pre-pass renderer has significantly lower requirements for both bandwidth and memory. The nearest engine comparison is Crytek 3, for rendering technology.

It should also be noted that Torque3D has single-pass dual-paraboloid shadows under DX9 which is something no other engine has unless they listened to my half-articulated ramblings on various forms/blogs and decided to give the crazy thing a try (It was one of those things where I said, this should work in theory, look horrible in practice...but after I coded it ended up looking pretty good). In fact, I'd go out on a limb and say Torque3D has the best DX9 shadow tech on the market. It'll have the best DX11 shadow tech on the market when it supports DX11. Can't wait to get my grubby little paws on that.
#92
11/13/2009 (1:19 pm)
Regarding the death of constructor in favor of poly soup, an interesting idea would be to take the Constructor editing tools and modify them to create DTS/COLLADA based poly objects instead of CSG ones. This would basically add an in engine 3d editor to T3D. Basically the existing Shape Editor on steroids.

But, the existing tool chain via Max, Maya, Softimage, et all allows you to do everything this would do and more. So the only thing you'd really get out of it would be being able to create/modify simple objects and structures right in the engine. I am not sure it would be worth the effort to do this, but it is an interesting idea.

#93
11/13/2009 (1:20 pm)
I saw a few of you guys compare UDK Lightmass to the 3rd party PureLight option that you can get for Torque3D and just wanted to point out a few things.

1. Visually both solution will produce the same results.
2. While Purelight is $500, you do not need extra hardware. With Lightmass you need to invest in a renderfarm. So while the upfront cost might seem scary, I guarentee you that you will save a boat load in the end by not needing to invest in a ton of new hardware just to generate lightmaps.
3. Purelight is faster than Lightmass.
4. Purelight is the only lightmapping solution on the market that is a) interactive and b) allows you to make adjustments and changes live while the lightmaps are being solved. Every other solution out there including Lightmass forces you to press the render button then wait 10 to 30 hours to see what the end result is, tweak and then repeat. Time is money and once again investing in the right tool for $500 will save your bacon here.


With regards to this blog and the fact that some of you have taken offense to what Brett has said. I think you missed the message overall and let your fanboism take hold. Brett is saying that both solutions are great and both solutions have their pros and cons as well as missing features. Torque3D is pretty awesome, only a fool would discount that, is it the best solution out there, no not yet and neither is Unity, UDK or the many other game engine solutions available out there. All that Brett is saying is that yes Torque3D is competetive with these other solutions, they know they have strengths and weaknesses in the engine, they are continuing to work on some AMAZING NEW FEATURES (sorry I am NDAd and cannot say, but theyre fucking spectacular) and contrary to all the panicked little chickens in the world, the sky is not falling.
#94
11/13/2009 (1:33 pm)
T3d very good....
#95
11/13/2009 (1:53 pm)
About baking lightmaps..
I have been working on a powerful tool(for 3ds Max) that is very easy to use. - I've named it "EasyLight!".
(It goes well beyond global illumination/baking lightmaps... But this is not the place nor time to talk about it.)
..I will say that the cost will not be anywhere near $500...but it's value will be.

I hope to have it ready by Xmas of this year. ;)
#96
11/13/2009 (1:58 pm)
GIve us full Mac compatibility, please. And soon. The product is quite badly marred by the discrepancies between the platforms.
#97
11/13/2009 (2:02 pm)
@Peter: Unless someone pulls a rabbit out of their hat, I don't think there is going to be AL for Macs as I believe there was an OpenGL wall they ran into while trying to get it working. Quite honestly I think the only option in the Apple line is the Mac Pro that would be able to run it anyway. I am sure there are other issues as well and hopefully they get addressed. Just an FYI.

@Eb: Sounds cool.
#98
11/13/2009 (2:13 pm)
@Joshua: Actually that is not true. All of the Intel macs have the hardware to run Advanced Lighting, the problem is the Apple drivers.
#99
11/13/2009 (2:19 pm)
Costing:
Crippled Free version remains the same.
Artist/Student no-source version $100-150
Pro version remains the same $1K or more (+upgrade discount)

Desires:
Pre-built and running game templates for RPG, RTS, Racing, FPS etc.
Items that continue to work as documented, or documentation that is always kept current as items change.
3D AI pathing (mesh and/or graph based), behaviours and demo included in Pro at no extra costs.
Mind blowing single level demo`s (1-2) to truly showcase engine power.
1 yr AUP (Automatic Upgrade Protection) with initial Pro purchase.

Not much more needed to close the gaps.
#100
11/13/2009 (2:45 pm)
Somethings you likely don't know about Unreal...

The terrain system is so bad that most games don't bother using it. Many games that need a good terrain system either use third party middleware, write their own, or they end up using Polysoup style meshes instead of using the built-in terrain system. Torque's terrain system could see some improvement related to streaming and paging, but it's still significantly better than Unreal.

Too much of the Unreal documentation is closed unless you've purchased a "source code" license.... you'll find yourself getting very annoyed at all of the little red links in their documentation. Torque's documentation is excellent. Congrats to the responsible parties! ;-)

But...

You can do a more things with Unreal without the source code than you can do with T3D without the source code. The Unreal tools are more polished, and there's actually quite a bit you can do without even resorting to script. I'm sure Torque Tech is focused on improving this, but we're talking here and now.

What would I like to see from Torque?

Make it so that you can get access to the source code if you need it, but make it less likely that you'll need the source code. Turn Torque into more of a library with a scripting and C/C++ API. Spend more time documenting that API.

Support more scripting languages like Lua or GameMonkey, or if you're stuck with CScript then spend some time improving a few things, like adding JIT compiling to native code, add support for upvalues, co-routines, state machine, tables (JSON / Lua tables), etc.

Add support for Linux, even if only as a dedicated server with no rendering, although I prefer full support.

Switch to CMake for you build system... it's awesome and it'll make maintaining things easier.

Provide the source code as a .zip or tar.gz in addition to the installation package in case you want just the source.

Torque3d is vastly improved over TGE, but it still looks like the source code to a game rather than high quality game development middleware.

I'll continue purchasing licenses for Torque... I'll do whatever I can to support Indie friendly companies (Epic and Unity Technologies Indie tolerant, but not Pro Indie). But, I don't expect I'll use Torque again until I see a marked improvement in the C++ API.