Torque 3D Development - Pricing and Licensing ANNOUNCED!
by Brett Seyler · 03/20/2009 (7:53 pm) · 496 comments
Hey everyone! I know some of you saw the Gamasutra story that revealed some previously unreleased details about Torque 3D. I'm going to to try to clarify the whole picture, and fill in any gaps with this post here. Because it's GDC week, I'm already down here in SF doing some PR, talking about iTorque, and talking to some local studios about Torque and InstantAction. Needless to say, definitely keeping busy, so I'm going to try to keep this as short as possible and focus on the stuff I know you most want answered. We've got a big week ahead of us :) I'm guessing we'll get a lot more questions answered in the comments, so feel free to throw out anything I don't cover here.
When I first started blogging on our dev progress in December, I really didn't think we'd get as far as we have, as fast as we have. Torque 3D is really a huge step up from TGEA, particularly with respect to the toolset, usability, and content pipeline. I think users will react most to the effort we've put into the tools, and we'll be showing much more of that in the next few weeks. Of course, we've done some major subsystem updates as well (Web publishing, Terrain, Post processing, Particles, etc).
Licensing
I posted twice on pricing & licensing (one of which is still probably the most commented on post in GG history) and we definitely listened. These were the main takeaways from the roughly 400 comments (and numerous emails) I got since.
Quote:1. Support, especially ticketed support is in high demand. If GG can find a way to provide this, there are Torque developers willing to pay for it.
2. A low entry point to Torque is important, even if it means some restrictions in the EULA or deprecating some features.
3. Greater polish, usability, stability and overall quality are paramount attributes for a high-end Torque product.
4. A focus on tools, and particularly usability in the World Editor, is the most important area to address in Torque 3D.
So we took all that, and really put your opinions into action, both from a development standpoint, and with respect to pricing & licensing. Here is what we decided on:
1. Two versions available on the website, Basic and Professional, each with an Indie EULA.
2. Basic and Pro have a feature delta, with the Pro package being targeted at existing TGEA owners, or pro / prosumer developers and studios who might need to create custom code modifications for their game. The Basic package is targeted at new users, who want to learn the tools, and see what the engine is capable of. You will be able to us Basic to create a game, even though we expect it to ship as a binary only. When working on a larger team, artists and designers often don't need access to the source code, and in these cases, the Basic package will probably be a better fit, given that team members can share compiled binaries with one another.
3. For those looking for a custom EULA, perhaps for an entire studio or for a single project that doesn't qualify for our "Indie" license, we'll respond to inquiries to licensing@garagegames.com. I should note that we probably won't touch any requests to this address that aren't from developers serious about a more expansive license and with the means and ability to pay for it. For example, our typical Studio licenses start @ $6k for a small team, and go up from there.
Features
The Professional version of Torque 3D will include everything we've talked about thus far, and a lot of what still hasn't been revealed. For example, we're planning to include updates to Physics, new Terrain, a Decal Editor, a Datablock Editor, River / Road / Path tools, and a Material editor in the final release.
The Basic version will not include Web Publishing, Advanced Lighting, or the River & Road Tools, but everything else is in there. It will also be binary only. Again, this version is probably not a good fit for most of you who currently own TGEA. We're offering the big discount during the pre-order period only on Pro, and TGEA owners will not be able to apply any of their TGEA license fee to Torque 3D Basic. Only to Professional.
We've been talking about Genre Kits and Add-ons a bit as well. There's some really good stuff coming there, but we don't have any pricing to announce with that yet. There's the Luma Racing Kit (based on their game "Rev" published on InstantAction, and including some of those production assets). There's a much updated FPS Starter Kit with work from Max Gaming and Apparatus. There's Sickhead's Forest Kit (not sure if that name is final or not) which is *really* cool. It will let you paint down foliage, or just random objects to the terrain or into a scene. I've seen this in action. It's going to impress the hell out of people. There's also Gerhard's expansion (unnamed at present) which will probably include a lot of custom assets and functionality on top of what you've already seen.
The takeaway w/ Genre Kits and most of these Add-ons is that they will likely be Pro-only.
Pricing
So, let's break this down just a bit more clearly.
What will Torque 3D cost me?
If you own TGEA Indie (and I think this is most of you now), your cost to upgrade to Torque 3D Professional is $1000 - $200 (pre-order discount) - $295 (TGEA Indie contribution = $505If you own TGEA Commercial, you can apply your license to Torque 3D Professional the same way an Indie owner can with a final cost of $505. If you'd like something similar to a Commercial TGEA license for Torque 3D, you'll need to contact us directly.
If you own any other Torque products, you can still purchase TGEA and get the same discount described above for a limited time. The pre-order discount will expire when we release release the final Torque 3D build (expecting this to be in May at the moment). The first beta will be delivered to Torque 3D owners in April.
There is no pre-order available for Torque 3D Basic, and there is no discount on Basic for existing TGEA owners.
Why Pre-order?
Access to the Torque 3D Closed Beta -- First delivery in April An exclusive Torque 3D T-Shirt Torque 3D private forum access on GarageGames.com Up to $495 off the full version priceAs I mentioned before, I'm going to keep posting blogs all the way up to our release, and probably for a while thereafter. We've still got a lot to show.
More sidebars and development blogs to come. This is post #15.
Torque 3D development blogs:
- Post #1 - Kickoff
- Post #2 - Apparatus and Warrior Camp
- Post #3 - Luma's racing kit
- Post #4 - Josh Engebretson and Web Publishing
- Post #5 - Pricing and Licensing
- Post #6 - Pricing and Licensing CONTINUED
- Post #7 - Wetness & Precipitation
- Post #8 - Screeen Space Ambient Occlusion (SSAO)
- Post #9 - Matt Langley and the Torque Launcher
- Post #10 - Chris Robertson and Collada
- Post #11 - Depth of Field
- Post #12 - Advanced Lighting
- Post #13 - Soft Particles
- Post #14 - World Editor
- Post #15 - Pricing and Licensing ANNOUNCED!
- Post #16 - GDC Live Edition
- Post #17 - River & Road Editors
- Post #18 - Beta is UP!
- Post #19 - Light Rays, Undercity, Material Editor
- Post #20 - Mass Market Hardware
- Post #21 - Beta: Part Deux
- Post #22 - Marching Towards Beta 3
- Post #23 - pureLIGHT
- Post #24 - Lighting, Terrain, and Cloth
- Post #25 - Beta 3!
- Post #26 - Coming Soon!
About the author
Since 2007, I've done my best to steer Torque's development and brand toward the best opportunities in games middleware.
#122
03/21/2009 (7:18 pm)
@David: Quote:So, for now, t3d is unattainable for us since source is a must. I do have a question though, about the Torque 2D engine. Now that t3d is coming out, any word on T2D pricing? Is T2D coming out this year? Can someone please detail what T2D's feature set will be? Or have these questions been answered somewhere already? Just curious... Thanks.No details on Torque 2D at present. We certainly be updating the editor for usability. Probably adding web publishing and all the stuff we've done with the Torque Toolbox. I know there are some planned announcements about Torque 2D a couple months down the road, so I don't want to stomp on that stuff. It's very cool, but all in good time :)
#123
03/21/2009 (7:27 pm)
Quote:I honestly can't see many people who are serious about game dev working exclusively with Basic.Yep...
Quote:So I at least hope a re-write of the Player and Camera class for making them more flexible is in the works, otherwise the Basic license could as well be labeled a "Tool license".From the lack of GG clear response on the matter, I suppose "Tool License" would be the right way to name it.
Quote:We're not trying to get in the way, just make sure that we can continue to provide a powerful, low-price option to developers without a big wallet.Wat? Low-price? Where and for what? "Dzing! Captain, the bullshit sensors are way off-chart! Call the President!"
#124
The price for professional is way too high. I don't think it will be worth it for alot of developers here. The price for upgrading from tgea to t3d should be lower as well. $200 for upgrading would be more reasonable. An upgrade price of $500 will only result in lower sales numbers. For a lower price, you will get ALOT more independent developers paying for it out of their own pockets. At this price point, people are much more likely to just stick with tgea than pay $500 for the updated engine.
The biggest change i see here is that source code is now part of a feature delta which I think is a really BAD idea. This never mattered before because before you weren't paying for the exe you were paying for the source code and anyone could download the binary along with the free demo version of the game engine. Offering a free demo would undermine those who pay $250 for basic, and not offering a free demo will create a demand for the executable and people will be ripping them from any t3d games or demos released. Also expecting people to pay $1000 or even $250 for a product without being able to even test it out beforehand is optimistic to say the least. If a free demo is offered, then what would be the point of purchasing the 'basic' version?
The feature delta set should include things like starter kits, license restrictions, and general engine features but not source code.
03/21/2009 (7:29 pm)
So what's the difference between 'basic' and the free demo version of T3d we'll undoubtedly be able to download and try out before paying $1000? :) Seriously, there will be a free demo download...right?The price for professional is way too high. I don't think it will be worth it for alot of developers here. The price for upgrading from tgea to t3d should be lower as well. $200 for upgrading would be more reasonable. An upgrade price of $500 will only result in lower sales numbers. For a lower price, you will get ALOT more independent developers paying for it out of their own pockets. At this price point, people are much more likely to just stick with tgea than pay $500 for the updated engine.
The biggest change i see here is that source code is now part of a feature delta which I think is a really BAD idea. This never mattered before because before you weren't paying for the exe you were paying for the source code and anyone could download the binary along with the free demo version of the game engine. Offering a free demo would undermine those who pay $250 for basic, and not offering a free demo will create a demand for the executable and people will be ripping them from any t3d games or demos released. Also expecting people to pay $1000 or even $250 for a product without being able to even test it out beforehand is optimistic to say the least. If a free demo is offered, then what would be the point of purchasing the 'basic' version?
The feature delta set should include things like starter kits, license restrictions, and general engine features but not source code.
#125
Did you even read what I said? I said license Source engine... You would own all you create. And if using the Source engine to create a game is "modding," then so is T3D. I think you need to actually look as Source before you make any assumptions. I can get all of the code to the engine(As long as I purchase a source game) and use it to create whatever I like. Once I develop a game I like, I can bring it to Valve, show them my work, and ask them if I can license the Source engine to sell the game commercially.
And yes, you can create a directory of all the source files without any HL2 content attached, meaning its not just modding HL2, like how T3D is "modding" Stronghold.
@Henry
"the GG model relies on users shipping finished games"
I've never really seen a game using Torque that got that far... Only things that come to mind are MBU(Made by GG themselves) Penny Arcade(Not Indie) and Tribes which, well, was before TGE was an engine.
"I've talked to that TGE is a 'beginners engine,' a sentiment that came mostly from its price."
Or it could be the lack of AAA features that GarageGames so proudly presents. That's what I see as people thinking this of as a beginners engine.
"shipping binaries to artists and level designers holding Basic licenses"
Advanced Lighting, road, river =/= Basic... The main tools a level designer or artist would WANT to have?
03/21/2009 (7:31 pm)
@BrettDid you even read what I said? I said license Source engine... You would own all you create. And if using the Source engine to create a game is "modding," then so is T3D. I think you need to actually look as Source before you make any assumptions. I can get all of the code to the engine(As long as I purchase a source game) and use it to create whatever I like. Once I develop a game I like, I can bring it to Valve, show them my work, and ask them if I can license the Source engine to sell the game commercially.
And yes, you can create a directory of all the source files without any HL2 content attached, meaning its not just modding HL2, like how T3D is "modding" Stronghold.
@Henry
"the GG model relies on users shipping finished games"
I've never really seen a game using Torque that got that far... Only things that come to mind are MBU(Made by GG themselves) Penny Arcade(Not Indie) and Tribes which, well, was before TGE was an engine.
"I've talked to that TGE is a 'beginners engine,' a sentiment that came mostly from its price."
Or it could be the lack of AAA features that GarageGames so proudly presents. That's what I see as people thinking this of as a beginners engine.
"shipping binaries to artists and level designers holding Basic licenses"
Advanced Lighting, road, river =/= Basic... The main tools a level designer or artist would WANT to have?
#126
03/21/2009 (7:33 pm)
@Edward Smith: Quote:mmm interesting. Well I brought TGE (when it was V12) and then its upgrade the EA for TGEA etc etc and now I'm wondering when will the next engine after this be out? in 12 months?We're going to try to establish a 12 month version update cycle, yes.
Quote:As it seems more and more often we're paying for updates.What? That's just silly. It's been more than 2 years since TGEA was released, and every update (through 1.8.1) has been totally free. TGB has been more than 3 years without any paid updates (through 1.7.4). Actually, the entire time I've been at the helm of Torque stuff (since Fall '07), we've pushed out more than a dozen updates for free. A lot of that stuff would be considered *major* updates as well. I do agree though that it's only fair to really set expectations as accurately as possible with you guys. As I've said, I want to get us on an annual version update cycle. We'll likely do multiple free updates, sometimes with additional features throughout the year as we always have.
Quote:How much will the genre kits be?There probably won't be a set price across all of them, and some are 3rd party, so Garagegames can't necessarily set the prices, but I definitely think the guys making 3rd party addons for Torque deserve more than they've been getting. Products like AFX and Torsion add huge value. I would like to see Jeff Faust and Sickhead well rewarded for what they've built.
Quote:T3D looks great, but is it? When can we expect to see what it can really do?Yes, it is. We're going to do some vidcaps of demos at GDC, and we'll be using uStream to show some live action, but the short answer is that yes, it is great and yes, you'll be able to see much more very soon.
Quote:Are there any improvements to the AI (like is there AI)?Gerhard's working on some cool stuff, but I don't have specs I can release on it yet.
Quote:I can't help feel that this price tag is for the cost of all the porting the engines to iPhone etc which I have no interest in.Huh? The iPhone branches of the engine are isolated projects and *totally* self-sustaining. If anything, we've been able to invest profits from iTorque into Torque 3D, not the other way around.
Quote:I think I would like to see some good examples of this before I fork out more which at the moment is another TGEA EA.Fair enough. There will be plenty more to see before we've released Torque 3D out of beta. I'll acknowledge that the TGEA EA was not so well executed (long delays, moving feature targets, too little testing), but in fairness, we've got *much* stronger resources to invest in Torque than we ever did during the TGEA EA period. I think our track record over the past 18 months speaks for itself. We're not about to botch anything here. You'll see :)
#127
03/21/2009 (7:35 pm)
Will there be a tech demo we can try before we pre order anything? I would like to see how this actually performs before investing any money in it.
#128
03/21/2009 (7:46 pm)
@Benjamin: Quote:I honestly can't see many people who are serious about game dev working exclusively with Basic.Yep...So I at least hope a re-write of the Player and Camera class for making them more flexible is in the works, otherwise the Basic license could as well be labeled a "Tool license". From the lack of GG clear response on the matter, I suppose "Tool License" would be the right way to name it.I think that working exclusively with Torque Basic to finish a complex game will be difficult, yet. I think this is true of any binary only game creation tool. Probably the largest reason for us providing a lower-priced Basic option was to save small teams the cost of purchasing a source license for everyone. Since artist and designers often won't need to touch the source, why not save them some money too? I also think that the Basic option will be a great way for users new to Torque to learn the toolset and get their feet wet with 3D game creation. Some, I expect, will take that all the way to publishing a game. Others will upgrade to a Pro license along the way. In any case, an additional low-priced option seemed like a good thing to do.
#129
... Concerning the Pricing delta. I don't think I'm exactly known for being overly "understanding" with GG choices and comments in the past. But in all fairness, I see absolutely nothing wrong with their chosen method of T3D pricing. In fact, it's more community friendly than even Unity's (and I like Unity). I understand that even though current TGEA owners are effectively getting a 50% discount which is alot more than I expected.. the $500.00 dollar price tag will still put it outside of some peoples reach. So.. you have several choices.. 1) Use TGEA, 2) Use TGE, 3) Use T3D Basic, 4) Save up your money, 5) Use another engine tech. How is it when GG puts TGE, TGEA, and a Basic Version of T3D within everyones grasp somehow a bad thing just because One version is priced higher?
I dunno guys.. But speaking for myself I'm pleasantly surprised with things so far.
03/21/2009 (7:56 pm)
Thanks Brett on clearing up the splash screen question. I have no issues with having one.. in fact I would have a GG Splash whether it was required or not. I just had major issues with the past and current styles posted for use is all. ... Concerning the Pricing delta. I don't think I'm exactly known for being overly "understanding" with GG choices and comments in the past. But in all fairness, I see absolutely nothing wrong with their chosen method of T3D pricing. In fact, it's more community friendly than even Unity's (and I like Unity). I understand that even though current TGEA owners are effectively getting a 50% discount which is alot more than I expected.. the $500.00 dollar price tag will still put it outside of some peoples reach. So.. you have several choices.. 1) Use TGEA, 2) Use TGE, 3) Use T3D Basic, 4) Save up your money, 5) Use another engine tech. How is it when GG puts TGE, TGEA, and a Basic Version of T3D within everyones grasp somehow a bad thing just because One version is priced higher?
I dunno guys.. But speaking for myself I'm pleasantly surprised with things so far.
#130
Seriously though, this pricing is probably the lowest pricing we seriously contemplated. What you think is reasonable, well, might be very unreasonable. I realize that we might not see some Indies adopt Torque 3D. We can't be everything to everyone, at least not with this product. Torque 3D is built to support professional development, but accessible by those working on a tight budget. If you can't come up with $1,000 for a 3D game development SDK, Torque 3D is probably overkill for your needs anyway. It would be like buying a $1,000 camera when all you need is a $200 point & shoot. If people want to stick with TGEA, that's totally cool too. TGEA is still probably the best bang for the buck in a 3D engine anywhere.
03/21/2009 (7:59 pm)
@Sean H.: Quote:So what's the difference between 'basic' and the free demo version of T3d we'll undoubtedly be able to download and try out before paying $1000? :) Seriously, there will be a free demo download...right?Yes, the difference will be a time limit on the demo probably.
Quote:The price for professional is way too high. I don't think it will be worth it for alot of developers here. The price for upgrading from tgea to t3d should be lower as well. $200 for upgrading would be more reasonable. An upgrade price of $500 will only result in lower sales numbers. For a lower price, you will get ALOT more independent developers paying for it out of their own pockets. At this price point, people are much more likely to just stick with tgea than pay $500 for the updated engine.Well that's just like, your OPINION, man?
Seriously though, this pricing is probably the lowest pricing we seriously contemplated. What you think is reasonable, well, might be very unreasonable. I realize that we might not see some Indies adopt Torque 3D. We can't be everything to everyone, at least not with this product. Torque 3D is built to support professional development, but accessible by those working on a tight budget. If you can't come up with $1,000 for a 3D game development SDK, Torque 3D is probably overkill for your needs anyway. It would be like buying a $1,000 camera when all you need is a $200 point & shoot. If people want to stick with TGEA, that's totally cool too. TGEA is still probably the best bang for the buck in a 3D engine anywhere.
Quote:The biggest change i see here is that source code is now part of a feature delta which I think is a really BAD idea. This never mattered before because before you weren't paying for the exe you were paying for the source code and anyone could download the binary along with the free demo version of the game engine. Offering a free demo would undermine those who pay $250 for basic, and not offering a free demo will create a demand for the executable and people will be ripping them from any t3d games or demos released. Also expecting people to pay $1000 or even $250 for a product without being able to even test it out beforehand is optimistic to say the least. If a free demo is offered, then what would be the point of purchasing the 'basic' version?Point taken on the demo / binary overlap. This is indeed a shift from the way we've done things in the past, and it won't be welcome by everyone. Like you, I think source code is pretty essential to shipping just about any kind of complex game. You can learn a lot about game development with just a binary SDK though, and you can probably ship a pretty wide variety of games with some compromises. Serious developers will probably purchase the Professional license in just about every case, but why not offer something to save teams w/ artists and designers some money as well?
The feature delta set should include things like starter kits, license restrictions, and general engine features but not source code.
#131
03/21/2009 (8:04 pm)
@Neill: Yes. I did. What I'm saying is that you might own the assets, but you don't own the product, not until you actually purchase a license. It's similar to modding in that way. Yes, you can get the source to the game and underlying engine, but without a license, you're sort of doing a bunch of work hoping that Valve will give you some kind of special break on the license. It's not in the price range of Torque :) You could always go in that direction and fall back on porting to an affordable engine later on I suppose. I guess that, were I in your shoes, I would like to be in charge of saying when my game was done and when I could publish it, rather than hoping Valve would see things the way I did.
#132
03/21/2009 (8:06 pm)
@Marcus: Quote:Will there be a tech demo we can try before we pre order anything? I would like to see how this actually performs before investing any money in it.There *may* be a tech demo available during the pre-order period, but we don't know yet. If you want to wait until the full release, we'll certainly be releasing tech demos by then.
#133
03/21/2009 (8:08 pm)
@Andrew: Quote:... Concerning the Pricing delta. I don't think I'm exactly known for being overly "understanding" with GG choices and comments in the past. But in all fairness, I see absolutely nothing wrong with their chosen method of T3D pricing. In fact, it's more community friendly than even Unity's (and I like Unity). I understand that even though current TGEA owners are effectively getting a 50% discount which is alot more than I expected.. the $500.00 dollar price tag will still put it outside of some peoples reach. So.. you have several choices.. 1) Use TGEA, 2) Use TGE, 3) Use T3D Basic, 4) Save up your money, 5) Use another engine tech. How is it when GG puts TGE, TGEA, and a Basic Version of T3D within everyones grasp somehow a bad thing just because One version is priced higher?Thanks :) As I mentioned, we really would like to get the community on a unified code base, so hopefully people who've been using TGE and TGEA make the move. That benefits everyone. For a lower-priced entry point, I think TGEA and Torque 3D Basic will both be good options.
I dunno guys.. But speaking for myself I'm pleasantly surprised with things so far.
#134
This is the reason I have stuck with GG and plan to, even though I have to use other games engines for the teams I support. I recently contacted another engine developer about purchasing the source - which was stated on the site to contact for pricing. Their response shocked me. They said you don't need the source code to build a complex game with our engine. What? No way would I fork out that much money for an API that "might" do what I need.
03/21/2009 (8:14 pm)
@BrettQuote:Like you, I think source code is pretty essential to shipping just about any kind of complex game. You can learn a lot about game development with just a binary SDK though, and you can probably ship a pretty wide variety of games with some compromises.
This is the reason I have stuck with GG and plan to, even though I have to use other games engines for the teams I support. I recently contacted another engine developer about purchasing the source - which was stated on the site to contact for pricing. Their response shocked me. They said you don't need the source code to build a complex game with our engine. What? No way would I fork out that much money for an API that "might" do what I need.
#135
03/21/2009 (8:29 pm)
This a a question that I don't think has been answered anyplace, but goes along with the DIF and DTS questions. One thing I noticed in the Collada test was that one of Tim Aste's old DIFs was one of the test colladas. How did you guys convert that from DIF to Collada, I'd imagine you probably ran it through a DIF to Max converter and then from Max to Collada, but was curious how that was done and if there would be any tools released for that?
#136
I also don't get how your complaining about paying $1000 for an engine yet you want to write something with the SOURCE and then fork over $250,000 or whatever in the end, without having full source code access. But really, its your money spend it on whatever you wish. I don't think your being objectionate here though.
03/21/2009 (8:36 pm)
@Neil: You've never seen a game ship with TGE that wasn't done by the developers? It happens all the time. You aren't looking very hard apparently. http://www.garagegames.com/torquepowered/tgea and http://www.garagegames.com/torquepowered/tge . I also don't get how your complaining about paying $1000 for an engine yet you want to write something with the SOURCE and then fork over $250,000 or whatever in the end, without having full source code access. But really, its your money spend it on whatever you wish. I don't think your being objectionate here though.
#138
the money is more then worth the price and i lucky to be part of the $200 discount. i could of very well looked for engines later and would of had to pay the $1k price tag. the money i saving will be spent ether on one or even 2 of the kits depending on how they are that forest kit sounds real nice right now its on the top of the list. :P i will continue to look forward on more post and try not to post here so much it was hard keeping me from posting on some of these as i had started typing then i said no i should wait. :P
there was some good questions even if i thought of them i would want it answered as well. i already know i want T3D even if they cant show me everything i would like to see.
03/21/2009 (9:06 pm)
well thats good i wanted to post so many times but it might make things worse as things was getting quite worse on some of these posts. i like what brett said in post #130 about it being the lowest they pricing they thought of as it truly is i think. like i said in many posts i would pay 2k but that was at the start of things now i rather pay about 3-5k as its that much better people. if you want a cheap engine with everything GG has build your own and it till take you years to do it by your self and thats just with all the new stuff for T3D.the money is more then worth the price and i lucky to be part of the $200 discount. i could of very well looked for engines later and would of had to pay the $1k price tag. the money i saving will be spent ether on one or even 2 of the kits depending on how they are that forest kit sounds real nice right now its on the top of the list. :P i will continue to look forward on more post and try not to post here so much it was hard keeping me from posting on some of these as i had started typing then i said no i should wait. :P
there was some good questions even if i thought of them i would want it answered as well. i already know i want T3D even if they cant show me everything i would like to see.
#139
03/21/2009 (9:06 pm)
I don't understand why the basic version doesn't have advanced lighting or the road/river tools. Why those features in particular?
#140
i for one amd gonna bend my budget as much as possible to get into T3d for the PreOrder. Even my wife (the one holding my wallet :P) agrees that i need it :P
Good on GG for the pricing. the engine is well worth it. every penny.
03/21/2009 (9:07 pm)
I personally, despite some of the new restrictions am looking forward to scrapping my wallet for $650 USD to get into T3D. the upgrades and improvments will be well worth it. i for one amd gonna bend my budget as much as possible to get into T3d for the PreOrder. Even my wife (the one holding my wallet :P) agrees that i need it :P
Good on GG for the pricing. the engine is well worth it. every penny.
Torque 3D Owner Brett Seyler
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