Why Pay $100 For It?

#1 What do you get for $100?

Well you get:
Licensed access to the TGE source code.
Free TGE code updates.
Access to the private forums.

What can you do if you don't want to pay?

You can mod the demo.
Use the regular forums.

So, you can make a mod without paying the license fee, but if you ask me the $100 was well worth the investment.

--Aaron

edit: spelling, note to self(proof read)

#2 a) The Torque Game Engine (TGE) is the exact same engine that powered Tribes 2... just that any IP from Tribes2 and any non-freely available libraries (namely sound) were pulled from the engine.
b) Realms War uses the TGE
c) TGE is NOT a "game creator program", it is a game engine that can be used in a variety of ways; i.e. mods can be done to games such as RealmsWar [which is basically a mod itself] or to the TGE demo [for free as Aaron points out] or you can further modify the engine to suit whatever game you wish to produce
d) In either case, listed in c), sufficient technical knowledge (programming, art [3D and 2D], sound, etc.) is needed to produce a quality title such as Tribes2.

#3 Ok so is there no point in getting "TGE" if I don't have any "game creator program." Since TGE is not a game creator program it must not be what I'm looking for. It sounds like some sort of... helper. To make your game better or something. Or am I just not getting the idea?

Also what is a Source Code.

#4 Honestly, if you don't know what source code is you aren't likely to be able to make a game. I'm not saying you never will, but it is obvious that you have A LOT to learn first. You might want to try something easy first, like 3dGameStudio by Conitec ( www.conitec.com ). 3d game studio allows you to pretty much "click together" levels very easily, but also has a C like scripting language and full C++ support for when you get more advanced.

#5 mmm... seems like you know nothing about programming, you are looking for some click n' drag game creator, and that's kinda hard to get nowadays, also they dont make good games, to make good games you have to code.
TGE is a game engine prgrammed in C++ and its the engine that powered Tribes 2

#6 Personally I don't think there is anything like you are looking for that will not require any understanding about programming that will create anything with any complexity. No matter what the language.

This is probably as close as you are going to get, and even then if you don't have a good understanding of programming idioms, you won't get very far.

"3D Game Studio / A5"

I have played around with this, and it is not as easy as they make it out to be, and requires coding to do anything beyond the most basic games.

#7 I dont know..
if you dont plan to code at all..
Just use the demo you dont need to buy the engine.

Go ahead and build maps, there is need for it.

Learn to build with BSP to add things to your maps.
Learn to make good textures for your BSP's

using just the demo you could make lotsa fun stuff :)

Learn to use all the editing power of the torque..


Press F11 in the demo app to get the ingame Editor.
Press F10 in the demo app to get the ingame GUI Editor.

#8 Forgive me but I am going to assume you don't know anything with the following explanation (if you do please ignore this):

Source code:
Text files that contain instructions for the program to follow, which are read by a program called a complier (C++ complier in our case) and translated into machine code (instructions that a processor(CPU) follows).

Program:
Most often a collection of source code files that solve a problem (ie. How can a display a 3D mesh on the monitor, or how can I communicate with other computers?)

Programmer:
A programmer is actually a problem solver who find's solutions to issues and breaks them down into simple algorithm's that can be converted into instructions a computer can follow.

Torque Game Engine (TGE):
TGE is a base program (starting point) for a programmer to create his game. By investing in a license he/she is building upon a proven foundation, there by allowing them to focus on the game and less on the technology. This allows teams that have no real financial backing ("Garage" team's if you will) to reduce the technical hurdle in getting there idea/dream into a working game.

Mod:
Using an existing games engine but changing behavior of the game (slight mod) or add my own models, meshes, textures and behavior to create a game (complete mod).

Draw back of a mod is you have to play by the rules of the engine. So, one of the main benefits of having the source code of TGE is that if you run into a limitation of the game engine, you can make the necessary changes to allow the engine to change and not your game.

--Aaron

#9 Well first of all thanks for your replys. This board is awesome how you guys help.

The only video game experience I have is Klick and Play, and The Game Factory. Which was 50$ but I've had years of use out of it, and a LOT of fun. I pretty much already knew what a Source code was. I'm not afraid to learn. I've spent hours reading stuff as confusing as javascript. Thats not an issue for me. I've always just dived into something I want to learn. I haven't checked out that other game program that you guys had mentioned. I know it's nothing compared to TGE. Basically what I want to know is, plain and simple... Can you make a game with TGE? Or is it just one of the tools you need?

#10 I wouldn't call it a tool... its the engine...
you'll need some tools to work with this engine..
a modeller program/2D graphic program/compiler/... those are tools, and they don't come with the TGE if that's what you want to know

#11 So basically 3d studio max, milk shape, and programs like that are the tools because their what creates the charactors, weapons, objects. TGE is what creates the levels. Is that right? Does it also create the science, which would be the Source Code. Like... collision, amount of lives ect ect ect.?

#12 TGE does NOT create "levels" or anything else it is the ENGINE that powers the "game".

It is written in a mix of assembly, c, and c++. It uses a C++ like scripting language for customizing a "game".

3D Game Studio A5 is MUCH closer to what you are asking for, and they have a great explaination of what you need to know. Go look at that page.

#13 Well lets just get this straight. I may be a noob or whatever you want to call me. But I REALLY can learn. And if TGE is better in the long run than thats what I want.

#14 > Well lets just get this straight. I may be a noob or
> whatever you want to call me. But I REALLY can learn.
> And if TGE is better in the long run than thats what I
> want.

Outside of A5, you are pretty much going to be dealing with some type of programming, whether it be in a scripting language or in C, C++ or Java [depending on the engine, etc.]. Since you mentioned JavaScript, I'll say that JavaScript is a pretty lightweight scripting language that isn't too hard to master. However, its syntax [how things are defined] is very close to C/C++ and Java so those languages will make a bit more sense, at least in simply looking at the code.

However, since TGE is programming in C/C++ [and its own scripting language], my advice would be to take a class in introductory programming at a community college, then an introductory C class and then a C++ class and read books on Object-Oriented programming and C++ programming. This would at least estabalish a base-line for understanding the code behind TGE, and the introductory programming class would better prepare you to understand TGE's scripting language.

Yes, you can hack scripting language and learn by yourself, but generally you'll end up getting frustrated or producing code that is inefficient or just plan bad if you don't have some sort of solid background in the ins and outs of programming [which can be got by taking classes in programming]. The experience I've had in other communities, namely the Unreal scripting community, and from evaluating potential employees [and screening the BS from resumes] is that many wannabe programmers [in a scripting sense] don't actually attempt to learn anything, they just hack for a bit, produce really buggy mods that may or may not work, and/or "steal" other peoples' ideas and then eventually fade out of the "scene".

That all being said, there is a core group of people here that will answer questions and help "newbies" out, as long as the newbie is making the attempt to learn the basics and doing legwork up front rather than just "give me code" type demands. Remember, the only stupid question is the one which you haven't tried to answer yourself to the best of your ability.

#15 Wow thanks for your time. Well I checked out that 3D GameStudio site. The Professional package which has obviously the best features, is $1250. Being I'm only 17 and looking for it as a hobby and not a career... I'm probably best to go with something more my type. Is the 3d gamestudio - profession better than the torque engine? I'd just like to hear the answer on that. $100 dollars doesn't sound so bad anymore for what TGE can do. In the long run I'd just enjoy making a nice RPG, or Doom style game at home. Theirs lots of choices out there. I guess I'll just have my thinking cap on for awhile.

#16 First check the links about the License agreement and Features in the Torque Engine Info section.
As far as Gamestudio vs TGE it's not much of a contest. TGE has much more potential but will be tougher to get what you want from it. Look in the Snapshot Gallery to see what some other people are doing. Some of the shots are pretty impressive.

#17 If I might make a suggestion: You can go to the FAQ section on the 3DGS site and Torque and 3DGS are compared there. Maybe you should just try learning C/C++ for a while. I haven't heard of anyone mastering game dev without a good understanding of the languages. I myself am searching and studying game dev and programming.

#18 Looks like they've expanded their site a bit since the last time I've looked at it. I know the Torque compare wasn't there. I think they might have added a few things to the engine as well. We were looking at it for a bit before deciding to go with the TGE.

#19 Jason, TGE is likely what you are looking for, but people here are suggesting it might be too complicated to start with and are suggesting alternatives.

Think of it this way: TGE is an "engine" in a car, the levels/maps are the "frame," the 3d models the "seats," the textures the "skins," etc. you need them all to make a Game/car.

#20 > In the long run I'd just enjoy making a nice RPG, or
> Doom style game at home. Theirs lots of choices out
> there. I guess I'll just have my thinking cap on for
> awhile.

If this is the case, you might start by putting together a mod for a finished product such as Tribes2, UnrealTournament, Half-Life, Quake3, etc. That way you'd at least have a viable engine that has produced a well-received game and have all the game [not engine code] scripting code available to you that runs the game. Personally, I think you'd be far happier with the results than with the 3DGS [its never been used to ship an AAA title that I am aware of unlike the other mentioned engines... correct me if I'm wrong]; after all you are pretty much doing the same thing - scripting, but the other games give you their game code [different from the engine code] whereas you'd have to pretty much write all the game code yourself with 3DGS and besides the games only cost ~$50 in which you also get the game itself to play.

Actually, looking through the site, for what you get with the "Commercial" package at $199, any of the games listed above or TGE give you a far better bang-for-your-buck when you are starting out and just want to put together games for yourself or to dabble around with.