Tetris / Chuzzle clones
by Andy Hawkins · in Torque Game Builder · 07/28/2006 (7:10 pm) · 18 replies
Why are people fixating on Tetris / Chuzzle clones for 2D games??? It's like every week I see another, slightly different, pretty much the same game coming up on the Torque pages. Surely there are other 2D ideas???? Or is it a good money spinner?
#2
07/29/2006 (3:42 pm)
Ahhhh....like a breath of fresh air!!! Sounds good Kevin. Another good use of TGB would be a game like Micro Machines 
#3
07/30/2006 (5:50 pm)
I think you have inadvertently answered your own question! Rather than coming up with one's own idea, it is simply easier to clone another favorite game.
#4
07/31/2006 (2:31 am)
So do you think it's too risky to make new games? Do people prefer to play it safe when buying indie games and go for the ones they have played before?
#5
Most of these match 3 type games bore me to tears. There are some out there that have one or two unique features, but none of them interest me enough to actually buy them. But like everything else, they keep getting churned out in the same way that some developers churn out FPS titles - and most of those are rather dull too.
I guess if you're trying to make a living out of game development, then you go to where the money is. And if the money is in match 3 type games, you'd be daft to ignore them. However, with so many out there, are you really likely to get very many sales?
If you make your money doing something else and you're dev'ing on the side, then go for the original game. At least your house won't be repo'd if you don't sell any. You'll probably also enjoy it more as it's something you want to create, rather than something you think you should create just to help pay the bills.
07/31/2006 (3:51 am)
I think you're confusing 'indie games' with 'casual games'.Most of these match 3 type games bore me to tears. There are some out there that have one or two unique features, but none of them interest me enough to actually buy them. But like everything else, they keep getting churned out in the same way that some developers churn out FPS titles - and most of those are rather dull too.
I guess if you're trying to make a living out of game development, then you go to where the money is. And if the money is in match 3 type games, you'd be daft to ignore them. However, with so many out there, are you really likely to get very many sales?
If you make your money doing something else and you're dev'ing on the side, then go for the original game. At least your house won't be repo'd if you don't sell any. You'll probably also enjoy it more as it's something you want to create, rather than something you think you should create just to help pay the bills.
#6
My 2 pence :)
07/31/2006 (5:28 am)
The casual games market is something targetted at by indie developers since these games are viable to create. However, through the success of zuma and bejeweled, people have tried to milk match-3 games for all its worth. If your planning on selling a match 3 game, have some feature which seperates it from all the others. Also, not all casual games have to be match 3 to be successful. Diner Dash and Diner Dash 2 are very popular casual games (was number 1 on the some portals last time I checked). It's even being ported to the sony PSP. But there are also games like "Kudos" and "Democracy" which sell quite well and are quite original in the casual market. Make what you think will sell and learn about your customers. The casual games market is generally aimed at 30-45 year olds (primarily female), who aren't very skilled with computers. This immediately tells you that creating a FPS with WASD controls and mouse aiming, with alternate fire isn't something that's going to appeal to them. At the end of the day, people have different purposes for creating games, and match-3 clones belong to an established genre, but that does make it difficult for new ones to stand out.My 2 pence :)
#7
Game design is an art in itself and just because you can program doesn't mean you can create a well thought out, creative, balanced and fun game. I know that I'm a much better game designer than I am a programmer and I typically put much more effort into the rules and game systems than making sure it's programmed optimally. (Well, within reason of course ;)
Also, I think it's smart to stay within what you can actually accomplish given your skills and/or resources and then move up from there. I mean, no offence, but do all these TGE owners really think they have the ability to create the absolutely massive amount of content that an MMO requires? Even if they do, who is going to play and pay for an indie MMO when you can get top shelf MMOs like EQ2 for $20 and WoW for $40? A Tale in the Desert is the only indie MMO I've ever seen that's had a decent amount of success and that's the exception, not the rule. Now if they're doing it just for fun that's another thing, of course.
And actually, some of the casual games are surprisingly fun. I love Big Kahuna Reef 2 because the gameplay and production is so incredibly polished. It's a nice little game to play for 20 minutes to chill out with a Jack & Coke before I head to bed or whatever. Same goes for Diner Dash 2 and many others. And there are some very interesting indies out there like Wik or Master of Defense.
I'm currently working on a fantasy/tactical wargame/CCG/board game hybrid in TGB. (I tried to add another genre but it wouldn't fit. ;) While it's derivitive of many games, I haven't seen anything out there even close to it. That doesn't guarantee it'll be fun but it doesn't hurt either.
07/31/2006 (12:41 pm)
As Ben and Apurva stated, I think a lot of it has to do with it being easier to make a clone with a slight variation than it is to come up with a completely new and unique game idea. (Not to mention a minimal need for art assets) But I think an even bigger factor is that it's relatively easy to make a puzzle game from a programming perspective. That's not to say it's "easy" since all game programming is pretty laborious but rather, it's much easier than making a more complex type of game like a Micro Machines or ISO/RTS/RPG.Game design is an art in itself and just because you can program doesn't mean you can create a well thought out, creative, balanced and fun game. I know that I'm a much better game designer than I am a programmer and I typically put much more effort into the rules and game systems than making sure it's programmed optimally. (Well, within reason of course ;)
Also, I think it's smart to stay within what you can actually accomplish given your skills and/or resources and then move up from there. I mean, no offence, but do all these TGE owners really think they have the ability to create the absolutely massive amount of content that an MMO requires? Even if they do, who is going to play and pay for an indie MMO when you can get top shelf MMOs like EQ2 for $20 and WoW for $40? A Tale in the Desert is the only indie MMO I've ever seen that's had a decent amount of success and that's the exception, not the rule. Now if they're doing it just for fun that's another thing, of course.
And actually, some of the casual games are surprisingly fun. I love Big Kahuna Reef 2 because the gameplay and production is so incredibly polished. It's a nice little game to play for 20 minutes to chill out with a Jack & Coke before I head to bed or whatever. Same goes for Diner Dash 2 and many others. And there are some very interesting indies out there like Wik or Master of Defense.
I'm currently working on a fantasy/tactical wargame/CCG/board game hybrid in TGB. (I tried to add another genre but it wouldn't fit. ;) While it's derivitive of many games, I haven't seen anything out there even close to it. That doesn't guarantee it'll be fun but it doesn't hurt either.
#8
07/31/2006 (3:49 pm)
Also, lets not forget that TGB is still very young. I suspect many people may have chosen puzzle games as their first projects because they are pretty simple and a decent way to get familiar with the engine. 
#9
By ISO do you mean isometric?
What's CCG?
. . . . .
I need to buy a book of acronyms or somethin'
^_^
07/31/2006 (3:51 pm)
Quote:it's much easier than making a more complex type of game like a Micro Machines or ISO/RTS/RPG.
By ISO do you mean isometric?
Quote:fantasy/tactical wargame/CCG/board
What's CCG?
. . . . .
I need to buy a book of acronyms or somethin'
^_^
#10
@Thomas: Yes, that is a good point and probably pretty accurate as well.
07/31/2006 (4:20 pm)
@Kevin: lol! I guess I did throw a lot of acronyms into one email. ;) Yes, I did mean isometric and a CCG is a collectable card game like Magic: The Gathering. Although my version is not collectable, it just uses cards as a means of randomizing how and when you can play units.@Thomas: Yes, that is a good point and probably pretty accurate as well.
#11
Mystic Inn
I must admit I'm a bit of a Word Jong fan... my wife likes Mystery Case Files... ahh well, if you can't beat 'em, join em...
Kudos and Democracy look cool too.
I think I'll have to write one of these clones just to see what's involved. I don't think I'll do a match-3 clone, maybe I'll do a solitaire clone instead.
When you look at it, FPS games are all Doom clones, which are really maze games, using Berserk / Pacman game dynamics. Half Life is kinda Robotron because you look after humans. All RTS's are most prolly based on Dune2. It's amazing that year after year we all buy the same game over and over and over and over and over and over again...
07/31/2006 (4:29 pm)
I'm getting sucked into these games already... this one looks great...Mystic Inn
I must admit I'm a bit of a Word Jong fan... my wife likes Mystery Case Files... ahh well, if you can't beat 'em, join em...
Kudos and Democracy look cool too.
I think I'll have to write one of these clones just to see what's involved. I don't think I'll do a match-3 clone, maybe I'll do a solitaire clone instead.
When you look at it, FPS games are all Doom clones, which are really maze games, using Berserk / Pacman game dynamics. Half Life is kinda Robotron because you look after humans. All RTS's are most prolly based on Dune2. It's amazing that year after year we all buy the same game over and over and over and over and over and over again...
#12
07/31/2006 (6:21 pm)
Haha, don't tell the public that one Andy, or no one will make money on games again! lol!
#13
07/31/2006 (11:36 pm)
I think this is why I get bored so quickly with games... I have bought so many and they just sit on my bookshelf... and I can't sell them because they are worthless now...
#14
These games will be made, as long as the public keeps buying them.
But... don't think making a clone will make you rich. Becuase of the competition your clone would have to be extremely polished, and have some unique features.
08/01/2006 (3:50 am)
Quote:I guess if you're trying to make a living out of game development, then you go to where the money is. And if the money is in match 3 type games, you'd be daft to ignore them. However, with so many out there, are you really likely to get very many sales?You think that if there's no money to be made anymore... big companies like popcap etc would still be doing these type of games?
These games will be made, as long as the public keeps buying them.
But... don't think making a clone will make you rich. Becuase of the competition your clone would have to be extremely polished, and have some unique features.
#15
08/01/2006 (4:32 am)
Oh, I'm sure if you get your game onto one of the major portals you'll shift a few copies, but how many Bejeweled clones are PopCap likely to list? If you can't get onto the portals, you're looking at doing a load of marketing work to get your game out there so you can sell it from your own site.
#16
08/01/2006 (5:05 am)
Which begs the question "how would one get their game on a portal?"
#18
Either contact them yourself, or go through a publisher, like our very on GG. If you go to the portal sites like bigfishgames and popcap, they have sections where you email them your demo/game and they will judge whether or not it's good enough. Publishers would do this for you to many different sites. Often, publishers would contact the more 'difficult' portals such as Yahoo.
08/01/2006 (8:35 am)
Quote:Which begs the question "how would one get their game on a portal?"
Either contact them yourself, or go through a publisher, like our very on GG. If you go to the portal sites like bigfishgames and popcap, they have sections where you email them your demo/game and they will judge whether or not it's good enough. Publishers would do this for you to many different sites. Often, publishers would contact the more 'difficult' portals such as Yahoo.
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