How powerfule is the engine ?

#1 Becher,

1. Torque's got the best network code around. So this first one is good.
2. Destructible houses and trees, as long as you program it, you can do it.
3. "Infinite terrain created by satellite" - uhhh... doesn't infinite mean never ending. And if it's taken by satellite, then what planet are you hoping to create... because earth's terrain is not infinite, it's just continuous.
4. Moving grass - I would hope that your grass would be planted in the ground.
5. Destructible terrain - I think several people in the community have created a terrain deformation resource, so this is possible.
6. "All existing vehicle types" - Do you mean EVERY? Every vehicle that's ever been created? Honestly... How big do you plan on making your game?

Seriously though. Torque's a good engine. But have you ever made a game? Or have you ever programmed? I know it's all fun to dream big about the games you want to make, but be realistic. Keep dreaming, but learn to think in attainable goals.

Why don't you make smaller games that focus on just one of those features you described above first. That way you can build your skills to a point where you'd be able to build the game of your dreams. This post is not meant to discourage you, but to encourage you to develop your gamedev skills before you bit off a HUGE project and never finish it. (If you've already got the gamedev chops, and have been doing this for many years, ignore my post... and yes TSE can handle what you want)

The GarageGames engines can handle what you want to create, but can you handle what you want to create is the big question.

#2 Just look up the specs on the TSE engine.
All of what your saying is possible.
TSE is what you want, maybe with TITAS.

1,yes , and even more than that with the proper server / modifications to engine.
2,yes
3,Yes I think but you would need a huge hardrive for that.
4,Yes,but that would be allot of collision detection I think.
5, The only thing im not sure of is destuctable Terrain.
6,Yes

-Surge

#3 Hello,

1) Torque can handle between 1 and 128 players on a network. This can be improved with code changes by you and your team.

2) Torque can handle destructable objects of any type, however, it's not built into the engine as such, and will require code and scripting changes by your team.

3) The Torque Game Engine cannot natively handle infinite GIS or other terrain data. However, the Atlas terrain sytem in TSE can do so easily.

4) Billboard grass with 'wind' animation is built into the engine. If you want a more advanced grass system, you and your team will need to develop it within the engine.

5) Deformable terrain is not built into either engine as far as I know. However, with some code changes and some scripting effort by your team, this can certainly be accomplished. The in-engine terrain deformer/editor is a great example of what kinds of terrain deformations can be accomplished.

6) Torque supports land and air vehicles natively. This includes automobiles, hovercraft, and fixed-wing aircraft. Also, water vehicles can be added into the engine without too much work. And rotary aircraft (helicopters) can be added in as well.

I hope this helps.

Aaron E.

#4 Wow. I should have refreshed my page before posting. ;)

#5 Wow... awesome job community. I saw this original post at 7:00, and was going to reply to it as soon as I put coffee in my mug and you guys already took care of it... all three of you.

Talk about an amazing community. Keep it up.

#6 Hi,
thanks for the fast reply.

Greets

#7 Where can i see more screenshots of the Torque Shader Engine especially for the Terrain - Atlas ?
I mean specially outdoor Screens.

I saw a demo of Tribes 2 and (sry for that) its not really looking good. I want to see what the new Shader Engine can do for Outdoor games.

Thx forward for the infos.

#8 Tribes 2 is *a few* years old. Look at other games from the same year before comparing it to today's games.
There's a few screenshots on the TSE products page which show the terrain, but I guess you saw that already?

#9 Hi, thy for reply.

Yes i saw them and yes you're right. Tribes 2 is *a few* years old. Thats the reaon why i want to see some actual screens. The best for me is a small video flying across a terrais with the newest shader engine.

:-D

Greets

#10 Hello,

Here's a link to a few TSE screenshots I've collected from the Garage Games site. One of these days I want to make a 'Consumer's Guide To Buying Torque' that shows off and promotes various Torque products. Until then, here's a link to a very basic page . . .

www.aaronellis.net/tsescreens.htm

WARNING: lots of large pictures.

#11 Hi,
thanks you helping me a lot.

But two questions left.
1)
I wrote some questions in the beginning of my post. Do out think the engine can handle ann stuff togehter ?
128 players, grass, destructable buildings, huge terrain, many vehicles ????

2)
if you compare the new shader engine with other existing new engine liks Farcry 2, Ut 2006, Huvok physics, and Ageia physics, what ranking TSE will have ?


Sorry for the many questions but theay are necessary for me.

Thanks and greets !

#12 Hi,
thanks you helping me a lot.

But two questions left.
1)
I wrote some questions in the beginning of my post. Do out think the engine can handle ann stuff togehter ?
128 players, grass, destructable buildings, huge terrain, many vehicles ????

2)
if you compare the new shader engine with other existing new engine liks Farcry 2, Ut 2006, Huvok physics, and Ageia physics, what ranking TSE will have ?


Sorry for the many questions but theay are necessary for me.

Thanks and greets !

#13 To answer your quetsions...

1) It all will mostly depend on three things....
a. your target hardware
b. Your server and netcode optimizations
c. Your Server hardware

2) TSE is a next gen engine. Bear in mind that it is still in its early adopter phase and is only on milestone 2-3. It still has a long way to go until it is a fully fledged as TGE is both in features and stability.

I think if you are willing to work a little bit and have the knowledge to code these optimization to the engine you can make a game that could rival what is made on those other engines.

None of this that you are asking will ever work _great_ "out of the box" in any of these engines. You would have to do the same as you would in TSE to make this work for those engines. Just think that this engine ends up costing A LOT less than the engines your have suggested. Im sure Unreals engine is in the tens of thousands for a license

#14 1. It depends on your time and programming team. Actually, any engine will be based on that with what you're asking.

2. There is no reason to compare TSE to Havok or Ageia. They are physics engines which you need to license separate from most game engines. They are not game engines. As for a comparison to FC2/UT2k6, etc., compare the hundreds of thousands of dollars in licensing costs to the licensing cost of TSE or C4, etc.

Here is a question for you.
1) Does your team have programming experience in C++? Are you familiar with shader technology, network metrics, the particulars or networking advanced physics in a simulation in real-time?

2) Does your team have the artistic experience necessary to model, texture, and shader accordingly depending on the technology used? Are they familiar with normal mapping, levels of detail, and polygon reduction techniques?

3) Do you have a budget which will accomodate for the hiring of staff to create content or program the necessary enhancements that your team does not currently have?

#15 I understand that my questions sounds nooby but be shure it isn't so.

I cannot explain too deep sry.
I have an expiried Team with big knowledge in Modeling, skinning, lod, quadtree...
Expiried in c++ but not deep in directx or shader technology. The models and Design Documents are finished.

I know the difference between a physics and a graphic or a game engine.
I want to do something big with these engine here (and this is not a dream).

I believe in this engine but my team not, so theay want to know more about it.

Thx

#16 Like we all have said. The engine can do anything you want it to, provided you have the knowledge to implement it. If your team is experienced as you have said then they should be able to do anything their little minds can imagine. The capabilities of this engine are as great as what Unreal and the Cryengine have to offer.

Oh...and refreshing after you post causes a double post. Just a friendly reminder so you dont populate the forums with duplicate posts.

#17 Does your team have several tens to hundreds of thousands of dollars necessary to license the likes of Unreal 2k6 with Havok for the platforms you want to target? Is your team a tried team that could secure such licensing? The reason I noted the difference between a game engine and a physics engine is because you lumped them into your comparison question. It is nearly impossible to answer your question without specifications. Do you want all 128 players on screen at once with 128 vehicles that they can get into and out of? In that scenario, do you want massive, complex terrain, photorealistic water (for watercraft), particle physics, networked ragdoll deformations, real-time networked mesh deformation using a combination of soft-body dynamics and vertex constraints? Does the state of the game need network persistence?

If it is somewhat close to what I've outlined above, you will need a huge amount of programming prowess and a lot of time with any engine.

#18 Have you downloaded the demo?
Have you seen the Legions movies?

And yes all your questions have already been answered.
You cant buy Any of the Engines you compared for the price of TSE.
You wouldnt even have a shot at them.

Just look at Brian Ramage's BLOG update from today, I think he said he has 10 Kork 4500 polygon
characters rendering at 140fps all with shaders. Thats really incredible if you understand that statistic.

http://www.garagegames.com/blogs/5030/10647

What engine, in your TEAMS price range do you know can do that?

Its worth a few hundred bucks to you and your experienced(you wrote expired???) team with big knowledge.
If your team so experienced then they should already know that the engines you compare or ask about are worth
$1,000,000(Shoot me if Im wrong). Compared with TSE at $1000 commercial.

TSE is the Deal of the Century, and your not researching this the correct way. Put some effort into that little search box, download the demo, and do some foot work yourself.

-Surge

#19 Ok. thanks all. you help me a lot. And sorry for the double posts. something wrong with my explorer .-D

Thx all

#20 Funny thread.