Game Development Community

A few Mac questions

by Ken Pajala · in Torque Game Builder · 03/29/2006 (9:32 am) · 10 replies

Hello,

Are there any issues as a Mac developer in using Torque 2D? Specifically I'm wondering if there are tools that are either Windows only or that aren't fully featured on the Mac side yet. I guess looking at Torsion (which isn't made by Garage Games I realize) got me wondering what else isn't available for the Mac yet.

Also, I notice that most of the games released so far using T2D seem to only have PC versions, i.e. Fortune Tiles, King Kong: Skull Island Adventure, Gold Fever. Is there a reason for this? Once you have a Windows version of a game, are there any issues with getting a Mac version out the door? Or are the developers of these games just unaware of the Mac games market?

And on a non-Mac related note, in other posts there were questions about programming in TorqueScript vs. C++, and I just wanted to verify that it is possible to use both. I mean, parts can be written in C++ and other parts in TorqueScript and they can interface easily?

Thanks!
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Employee David Montgomery-Blake
David MontgomeryBlake
#1
03/29/2006 (9:44 am)
Your artpath shouldn't be an issue on the Mac. Torsion and other TorqueScript IDE's are windows based because that was the developers' targets. You can use XCode or BBEdit to do your coding/scripting. I do.

On the issue of developers not seeming to target Macs...well, many game portals point to the Windows market simply because it has a huge install base. It isn't necessarily that the developers are shunting the Mac market, but in terms of distribution, portals determine a much larger install base than the typical indie casual game Mac market.

And, yes, you can use both C++ and TorqueScript. You just have to expose anything you want to use TorqueScript with in your code.

Torque 3D Owner Marc 'Dreamora' Schaerer
Gayasoft
#2
03/29/2006 (10:46 am)
The largest issue getting Mac versions of the apps out: You need to pay Apple to get one, you can't use your "payable" dev machine you already have for Linux and Windows. Macs just aren't that cheap after all (if you want a usefull dev machine which means iMac or PowerBook / MacBookPro)

Torque Owner Ken Pajala
#3
03/29/2006 (2:48 pm)
Ok, good to know.

And fortunately I'm using a Mac as my development machine and so don't have to worry about the expense of buying another one.

But that reminds me, I guess I'd have to buy VC++ when I want to release for Windows. Would it still be a good idea to get the 2003 Edition you get with the book that Garage Games was recommending (see below)? Or should I get some flavor of 2005, either the Express or Standard?

http://www.garagegames.com/index.php?sec=mg&mod=resource&page=view&qid=5288

Thank you.

Employee David Montgomery-Blake
David MontgomeryBlake
#4
03/29/2006 (8:05 pm)
You can download 2005 Express for free. You will need to download the platform SDK and the Direct X SDK as well, though.

Torque Owner Jon Frisby
MrJoy, Inc.
#5
03/29/2006 (9:29 pm)
As a Mac T2D developer, it's been my experience that the Mac version lags the Windows version in terms of stability and polish. Things that work on Windows tend to be broken on Mac for quite a while before they get fixed. So technically you have "feature parity" between the two, in that you're getting the same codebase for Mac as you get for Windows (unlike the Linux version which tends to lag a point release or two), but don't count on it being as mature as the Windows side.

For example: With T2D 1.0.x, audio doesn't work on Tiger without a community-created patch. With T2D 1.1BETA, screen resolutions are not detected (it's hard-coded to a list of 640x480, 800x600, 1024x768, and 1280x1024) -- that feature actually WENT AWAY (I'm currently working on hacking in the old Mac resolution detection code but I wouldn't count on anything...). I'm sure that eventually the Mac version will be robust as well, but the bottom line is that people have shipped games for Windows on T2D, and the Mac version isn't at the point where you could do that yet unless you're willing to invest some engineering effort in cleaning it up.

-JF

Torque 3D Owner Stephen Zepp
#6
03/31/2006 (2:43 pm)
Jon brings up a good point--we do our best to keep the Mac build at least as close as possible to the windows build, but here's roughly our balance of numbers on the developer side:

Windows-many
Mac-one
Linux-none

And the one Mac guy is shared between TGE and TGB, so he doesn't always get on top of everything in time for the intermediate releases (although he sure does try!).

Torque Owner Jon Frisby
MrJoy, Inc.
#7
03/31/2006 (4:16 pm)
When I get filthy rich off my cheap clone of Lumines I'm buying all of you guys Macs, and hiring someone to smash all your Windows boxes. :p

-JF

Torque Owner Bruno Grieco
#8
04/01/2006 (4:59 am)
@Stephen

You can add me also to your T2D mac development list. But I beleive there are others too.

Torque Owner Ken Pajala
#9
04/01/2006 (8:06 am)
Thanks for the info. I've now purchased T2D and am just starting to delve into it.

It's good to know that the Mac version is close to the Windows. And if anything, I'm glad that it's the Windows side that is more stable since I have no desire to fuss with Windows issues, but have no problem going under the hood on the Mac. Screen resolution code, for instance, should be fairly easy to work out (although I should look at the T2D interfaces before saying such a thing).

And what's this about a T2D mac development list? Sign me up if there is such a beast :)

::kp::

Torque Owner Jon Frisby
MrJoy, Inc.
#10
04/01/2006 (9:23 am)
@Bruno: I think Stephen was referring to GG employees. There are at least 3 Mac users of T2D! :)

@Ken: I would look at T2D 1.0.2 and try to forward-port the code from (I think) macOGLVideo.cc if I were you. That's what I'm attempting to do anyway, although my C++ is weak enough that it's an uphill battle for me.

-JF