Very interesting poll on 2d gaming!
by jesusphreak · in General Discussion · 04/16/2005 (7:13 pm) · 11 replies
Check this out.
I visit TeamXbox.com quite a bit, just to read up and discuss different things. Torque2D has gotten me thinking a lot lately about 2d gaming, so I decided to make a poll about it. Keep in mind, a lot of the people here are hardcore Xbox gamers would are fans of Halo, Chaos Thoery, and just about any other big 3d title you can think of.
So I make a post discussing some things, and I attatch a poll titled "Do you think a 2d engine (in 3d) could lead to a good game?". As of 9:08 CT Saturday evening, the votes are:
22 - Hell yes!
7 - Could be interesting.
4 - Not really interested
2 - I will only play 3d games at this point.
Wow.
I think these are VERY positive numbers for something like Torque2D. When you consider the fact that these are the most hardcore of the harcore generally, its crazy to think of the potential for casual gamers across all platforms. The funny thing is, a lot of gamers really just want to see your basic shootem ups, similar to games they played in the past. I think a 3D accelarated 2d game that brings something new to the table could be even more popular than what this poll suggests.
Very interesting numbers. Anyway, here's the link.
I visit TeamXbox.com quite a bit, just to read up and discuss different things. Torque2D has gotten me thinking a lot lately about 2d gaming, so I decided to make a poll about it. Keep in mind, a lot of the people here are hardcore Xbox gamers would are fans of Halo, Chaos Thoery, and just about any other big 3d title you can think of.
So I make a post discussing some things, and I attatch a poll titled "Do you think a 2d engine (in 3d) could lead to a good game?". As of 9:08 CT Saturday evening, the votes are:
22 - Hell yes!
7 - Could be interesting.
4 - Not really interested
2 - I will only play 3d games at this point.
Wow.
I think these are VERY positive numbers for something like Torque2D. When you consider the fact that these are the most hardcore of the harcore generally, its crazy to think of the potential for casual gamers across all platforms. The funny thing is, a lot of gamers really just want to see your basic shootem ups, similar to games they played in the past. I think a 3D accelarated 2d game that brings something new to the table could be even more popular than what this poll suggests.
Very interesting numbers. Anyway, here's the link.
#2
04/16/2005 (8:33 pm)
Its like any other poll, of course it doesn't represent everyone, but its representative of a larger portion. Again, this is an Xbox gaming website, probably not the best place to poll anyway, as casual gamers would probably be even more excited about something like this. 
#3
I admit, I still have the same kind of bias... I've been a fan of 3D gaming since it was all wireframes, and always felt that the first-person perspective was "where it's at." But I'm no longer in the camp that prefers 3D for 3D's sake. I've seen games where I've found myself saying, "They should have made this 2D."
So maybe that transformation is happening. Or maybe it's wishful thinking on my part.
04/17/2005 (12:24 am)
It's entirely possible that now that 3D gaming is no longer new and it is starting to run out of tricks up its sleeve, people are starting to lose a little bit of the attitude that 2D is somehow "inferior."I admit, I still have the same kind of bias... I've been a fan of 3D gaming since it was all wireframes, and always felt that the first-person perspective was "where it's at." But I'm no longer in the camp that prefers 3D for 3D's sake. I've seen games where I've found myself saying, "They should have made this 2D."
So maybe that transformation is happening. Or maybe it's wishful thinking on my part.
#4
04/17/2005 (12:46 am)
I think that 3D graphics have gotten so good that making impressive 3D graphics is old... its practically to photo realism with HL2 and Doom3... so now people aren't ooh'ing and ahh'ing over them anymore, they realize the gameplay can suck even with great graphics... thats where 2D titles come in, lots of gameplay for little buck :)
#5
04/17/2005 (7:08 am)
Of course theres also the real possability that the way you worded the question just confused them :p
#6
Been experimenting with some of this stuff whilst coding my own game and it really works quite well, and its nice to have dynamic lights and shadows in a 2D shooter.
04/17/2005 (8:21 am)
You can also make 2D games in 3D, and get smaller more interesting media. More dynamic animation etc. really depends on what you mean by 2D games. it's often easier to make a more interesting 2D game in 3D and have the benefits of both. Just because it looks 2D doesn't mean it has to be made in 2D. Been experimenting with some of this stuff whilst coding my own game and it really works quite well, and its nice to have dynamic lights and shadows in a 2D shooter.
#7
04/17/2005 (10:28 am)
Adrian, do you have any screens or media on the game you are making? That sounds interesting.
#8
The game is simply amazing--I had forgotten just how wonderful it was. From the <100 poly 3-D point of view models, to the fully animated sprites to the sound track to the voice overs--first game I think I've seen where not only do the voiceovers give you game information that can be critical for play, but inject some hilarious humor while you are playing. Just some quotes:
(you've been paused for 10+ minutes, and just come back):''They very earth yawns with anticipation of your next move."
(it turns midnight on your local system clock): "It is the witching hour..."
(you've been playing for several hours, and it's after 1 AM local time): " Even Dungeon Keepers must retire to a lair of some sort musn't they?"
All in the very sarcastic and droll voice of your "assistant".
The game is just perfect in almost every way--more than 6 years behind the "times", yet best gameplay I think I've ever had!
Just goes to show--while some of the market may swear by 3-D, it's the production values that count.
04/17/2005 (2:29 pm)
I just finished playing the campaign of a fresh install of Dungeon Keeper II--a 2-D game made back in 1999 that to me illustrates the fundamental fact that "fun" != first/third/iso/2-D point of view, but the production qualities that are part of the product itself.The game is simply amazing--I had forgotten just how wonderful it was. From the <100 poly 3-D point of view models, to the fully animated sprites to the sound track to the voice overs--first game I think I've seen where not only do the voiceovers give you game information that can be critical for play, but inject some hilarious humor while you are playing. Just some quotes:
(you've been paused for 10+ minutes, and just come back):''They very earth yawns with anticipation of your next move."
(it turns midnight on your local system clock): "It is the witching hour..."
(you've been playing for several hours, and it's after 1 AM local time): "
All in the very sarcastic and droll voice of your "assistant".
The game is just perfect in almost every way--more than 6 years behind the "times", yet best gameplay I think I've ever had!
Just goes to show--while some of the market may swear by 3-D, it's the production values that count.
#9
I introduced Jeremy to that game a few month ago, and wish more people would play it, definately one of the best games of all time, and not to be missed. I'd give it an almost perfect score too.
I'll probably post a little snapshot page of my 2D in 3D game soon. It's pretty simple, I basicly took the old 1943 game, and did a retro remake, only with a very slight perspective top down view and tall buildings. I'm not really much of a coder, being a 3D artist which is why I startewd with something so simple.
04/17/2005 (4:29 pm)
Heh, first taste of game dev was on dungeon keeper/deeper dungeions back in 1997, just before EA bought bullfrog and everyone left to form lionhead. Dungeon Keeper 2 is still one of my favourite games of all time, was really upset me when EA dumped on it. Been a while since I played DK2, I'm pretty sure theres a D3D patch for it, allthough one of the cool things about software rendering in the first one was the FPS views, which had all manner of lense distortion depending on which character you had posessed. The fly had a multifaceted lense.I introduced Jeremy to that game a few month ago, and wish more people would play it, definately one of the best games of all time, and not to be missed. I'd give it an almost perfect score too.
I'll probably post a little snapshot page of my 2D in 3D game soon. It's pretty simple, I basicly took the old 1943 game, and did a retro remake, only with a very slight perspective top down view and tall buildings. I'm not really much of a coder, being a 3D artist which is why I startewd with something so simple.
#10
IMO the first person view in dk2 was only a feature, i never used it when played the game seriously, only when i was "boring" with mining gold, and take a look at around with my imps.
04/19/2005 (6:50 am)
Adrian : Yes, DK2 is absolutely a masterpiece, a must see to everyone. Could be nice to see an up-to-date remake (or we call it as a "clone") with TSE. Anyone ? :)IMO the first person view in dk2 was only a feature, i never used it when played the game seriously, only when i was "boring" with mining gold, and take a look at around with my imps.
#11
04/19/2005 (8:18 am)
@Adrian: I might have misread your post, but are you saying that you worked with Bullfrog on actual development of DK2? If so...I'd like to chat with you, might send an email!
Torque Owner nibbuls