Printable documentation needed

#1 If you look in the documentation section, you can see some things about a program called Doxygen wich basically creates all of the engine docs in html format for your computer. That way you can print them out.


As far as script based stuff, there isnt much on paper. You can pick up kens 3d game programming all in one or you can look in the resources and find a torque script windows help file. I think you can print off of that

#2 True.

but what i really want is all official documentation both code comment(which i have to extract it by using doxygen) and getting started/tutorial(is it possibble to leech it?) and stuff printed out in a nice wrapped book.

any luck?

#3 Abdullah, we'll have printed documentation in the coming months, but it's not available pre-printed just yet. For now, you can download whatever chapter you're reading from the official docs and print it, or print chapters from other great docs, like the free / preview version of the Essential Guide to Torque, which is another book that we'll be printing soon.

#4 By download did you mean browse the page, wait, then save as blah, then on to he next page, wait, then save as blah, ... do this couple hundreds time?

#5 "Abdullah, we'll have printed documentation in the coming months" - Josh

Very good! I too am interested in printed docs so that I don't always have to be connected to the net or have to use my PC to learn about TGE. BTW, its probably obvious that I am new to TGE also.

Having said that I have been reading the Official SDK docs and am very impressed so far with the documentation. As everybody who programs knows, many times what are called documents are simple the comments in the source code and the source code itself.

-SJ

#6 Jones.

"Having said that I have been reading the Official SDK docs and am very impressed so far with the documentation. As everybody who programs knows, many times what are called documents are simple the comments in the source code and the source code itself."

then please tell me why garagegames put hundreds of pages here called "official docs"? why dont i see anyone programming with printed codes alongside? can i view it offline? or can i leech it?

by the way, last night, while browsing the tge folders, i found a file called "engine.overview.txt" which was really helpful. before going through tiny bits of code, a general overview of the engine is a critical information. once you have good understanding of the engine flow, it time to move on to real implementation.

the main reason for me to settle with torque is
-you have to pay for it(ensure continuous developer support)
-but its cheap
-active community support
-(expected)extensive documentation for both engine and game source which i can print
-published real games(proven)
-hopefully i can learn how to construct a 3d engine(maybe in the next 10 years)
-(expected)tge is an API but found out that game source tied with engine source is a much more practical approach.
-i am planning to modify the engine source(add features)

tge doesnt lack documentation, in fact it have a good documentation(from few getting started pages i've read). but as i said, I WANT IT PRINTED.

josh, thanks for the reply. but please hurry(hope my anxiety doesnt wear off by then).

#7 Well, I guess if you want to pay people at GG out of your pocket to compile your docs ahead of more important stuff they have on their plate, you could get GG to conform to YOUR time schedule....

#8 Pay more? how much?

#9 Any update on when the printable documentation will be up? I'd love to get a hold of that.

#10 When It's Done. (tm)

#11 Almost 4 moths already. It is done?

#12 I'm guessing, but I think they may be waiting for tge 1.4 & tdn to come out.

#13 Can we get the docs in the distribution yet? Why would they not be included? Piracy?

[Edited for professionalism....]

#14 Professionalism is good. :)

Piracy is the big issue. We don't want to make it easy for people to warez Torque, and having the docs seperate makes that more difficult. We might someday switch to a unified distribution, but not yet.

#15 Fighting piracy is good indeed. but if it hurts the loyal supporter, the innocent buyer, i dont think it is a wise choice. just my 2 cents.

#16 It's a tough balance. We're working on finding that right balance point.

#17 @Abdullah: I have read quite a few posts where people ask about printable docs, or just more documentation all together. I think if you would spend some time 'looking' through the source code you would quickly realize that TGE is so big, that even the most diligent attempts to document it will lead to complaints in the future about the 'printed book' or 'new documentation' not being complete. That's not to say printable docs, or books should not be created or attempted, but realize that even the best attempt will fall short of containing 'all' the information about the torque engine; which seems to be what most people who complain about documentation are looking for.

Just to voice my view on the documentation issue, lets use an example from mathematics:

There is a man who becomes fascinated with math and its advanced applications. He goes online and downloads the most awesome math program ever invented. This program can do most everything, but has no kindergarten level user interface (for obvious reasons). Instead, this program contains advanced math routines and functions that the end users can modify and adapt to solve complex problems. These routines can be used in an infinite number of ways and in an almost infinite combination with one another to solve just about any problem that might arise. After browsing through this fictitious math software package our 'eager beaver' quickly realizes that there is little to no documentation describing each of these advanced math functions, and more importantly the documentation does not give any background about the inner workings of advanced mathematics in general, nor does it equip him to use this advanced math software package like a math pro.

So, he goes online to the fictitious math software website, navigates to the most appropriate forum, and writes a nice message describing the shock and disappointment he has experienced because this 'great' math software package failed to include documentation that would transform him into a math pro that would in turn allow him the use this great math software package to its full potential.

The lesson of this story should be abundantly clear. Countless pages of documentation describing every feasible way to use existing routines will not equip you with the skills you will need to make the software 'sing'. In much the same way buying a musical instrument and expecting a 'manual' bundled with the instrument to teach you 'how' to play the instrument, is not only unreasonable, but serves to reveal much about the one making the request.

In the end, there are no quick solutions, or easy fixes to gaining knowledge and skill in advanced areas of development. Hard work, a good understanding of fundamental principals, and practice will reward you with the understanding and abilities to accomplish just about any task you set out to complete.

So.. Quit whining, and get to work!! ;)

B--

#18 @Brandon, actually your example doesn't quite fit the current scenario Your story implies laziness and a lack of knowledge. It's more like ordering furniture from Ikea and finding out the instructions to put it together are online only. There are books on Mathematics and if your fictitious Math program had no explanation of its interface it would be destined for failure.

Garage Games is indeed between a rock and a hard place and the truth is the documentation is printable, it is just very tedious to do so. So I guess the point is that if you want to print the docs bad enough you can.

[Edit] Just on a side-note Torque is heavily documented and supported. This was a large reason why I chose it for my project. I certainly, did not mean to imply otherwise. [/Edit]

#19 @Foz: You might have read too much into a story. The mathematics example serves to emphasize that a fundamental understanding of math is required before attempting to 'master' a math program, and also draws out the point that documenting the 'math program' functions will be of little use without a firm understanding of math. With a well rounded foundation in math, one could view the functions of the math program, and begin using and molding these routines to accomplish the task at hand, but thinking that a printed book describing the basic uses of these routines will lead to any sort of 'productivity' without first having firm understanding of the fundamentals is erroneous at best.

The story was not intended to point out laziness or a lack of adequate documentation, but rather a lack of fundamental knowledge leading to requests for information that will be of little use if you cannot understand the fundamentals; which if you did have a firm grasp of fundamentals the printed documentation would be of minor not major importance since you could always go to the 'source' and see 'exactly' what is going on, and more importantly 'why'.

In the end, you can read all you want, and have all the books of the world in printed or searchable form, but it will be of little use to you if you cannot understand, and apply it. So the moral to the story would be to seek a better understanding of the fundamentals, which will equip you to better discover, understand, and solve whatever problem is at hand.

All of this of course is proven by the track record of TGE itself. Even before there was a 'wealth' of searchable knowledge available in the forums we have today, awesome games were made, have been made, and are being made by people who have strong fundamental skills in their respective fields of expertise. So quit thinking that a 'Bowflex' is going to get you in shape, and instead drop down right now and do some pushups! It's the best way to improve. Sure it's nice to have a 'Bowflex' but there was life before it was ever invented.

B--