Engine effectiveness for indoors only
by David Flor · in Torque Game Engine · 02/01/2004 (3:05 pm) · 4 replies
I know this has probably been asked before, and I do apologize if it has. I'm on a computer now that's charging me by the minute, if you must know...
I am actively considering Torque for a major development project, but unlike all the games that I've seen - games that have massive, outdoor environments loaded with lots of terrain - most of the maps I'll be contending with are either entirely indoors or very briefly outdoors, the outdoor parts not requiring extensive terrain work or anything.
I have been looking for some demo that is entirely indoors and have yet to find one. I want to see how it feels in an indoor only environment, and how effective the portals are handled and whatnot. Also, I don't quite know how mapping work with this yet - I know map entities can be created with WorldCraft/Hammer/Quark but the discussions have been more for creating structures on top of the terrain and not a fully enclosed area - so I'm not sure of the dependency on terrain.
I've also seen discussions about turning the terrain "off" through the mission editor, but that sounds odd. Mainly because I don't quite know yet how maps are actually compiled; in Quake or Half-Life, maps that aren't completely enclosed "leak" and don't compile fully. Is that the case here as well?
Anyway, looking for insight here. Really interested in Torque, but I want to know exactly what I'd be getting in to in this regard.
Thanks for your input.
I am actively considering Torque for a major development project, but unlike all the games that I've seen - games that have massive, outdoor environments loaded with lots of terrain - most of the maps I'll be contending with are either entirely indoors or very briefly outdoors, the outdoor parts not requiring extensive terrain work or anything.
I have been looking for some demo that is entirely indoors and have yet to find one. I want to see how it feels in an indoor only environment, and how effective the portals are handled and whatnot. Also, I don't quite know how mapping work with this yet - I know map entities can be created with WorldCraft/Hammer/Quark but the discussions have been more for creating structures on top of the terrain and not a fully enclosed area - so I'm not sure of the dependency on terrain.
I've also seen discussions about turning the terrain "off" through the mission editor, but that sounds odd. Mainly because I don't quite know yet how maps are actually compiled; in Quake or Half-Life, maps that aren't completely enclosed "leak" and don't compile fully. Is that the case here as well?
Anyway, looking for insight here. Really interested in Torque, but I want to know exactly what I'd be getting in to in this regard.
Thanks for your input.
#2
Torque is much less stringent about leak requirements; of course, if you do have a leak, that will make the area around the leak be "outside," which can mess things up a little bit.
02/01/2004 (10:01 pm)
It's DIF, Dynamix Interior Format (I guess on that part), not diff as in difference. Don't mean to pick on you, just noticed a lot of people making the mistake as of late. :)Torque is much less stringent about leak requirements; of course, if you do have a leak, that will make the area around the leak be "outside," which can mess things up a little bit.
#3
The major effect of having a leak will be that the area in question will not be lit correctly. You can searcch for holes in Quark to fix this problem, so it is possible to find leaks, but the game itself will not complain about them.
In my experience performance is great in interiors-only scenes, so long as you portalize them properly. You can delete the terrain entirely from the missions (as is done in Marble Blast), leaving interiors only.
02/02/2004 (3:08 pm)
The prefered modelling tool is QuArK, but Worldcraft or other Valve220 .map format capable programs will work also. We recommend Quark because it is full-featured and is open source - preventing any icky licensing issues.The major effect of having a leak will be that the area in question will not be lit correctly. You can searcch for holes in Quark to fix this problem, so it is possible to find leaks, but the game itself will not complain about them.
In my experience performance is great in interiors-only scenes, so long as you portalize them properly. You can delete the terrain entirely from the missions (as is done in Marble Blast), leaving interiors only.
#4
I've just been concerned because it seems like the focus of the engine is maps with vast terrain. I'm primarily looking just for an engine, and grotesquely huge maps is not my target. So I have some concerns.
Besides Marble Blast, are there any other demos that use a non-terrain, entirely indoors environment? Never played Tribes 2 at length myself, so I don't even know if levels within that product would suffice for me to see what I'm looking for.
Thanks for all the assistance.
02/02/2004 (3:20 pm)
I appreciate all the input so far - still eager to learn more, and still scrounging about to try to get this license so I can start messing with it. But, alas, "Real Life" (tm) keeps getting in the darn way.I've just been concerned because it seems like the focus of the engine is maps with vast terrain. I'm primarily looking just for an engine, and grotesquely huge maps is not my target. So I have some concerns.
Besides Marble Blast, are there any other demos that use a non-terrain, entirely indoors environment? Never played Tribes 2 at length myself, so I don't even know if levels within that product would suffice for me to see what I'm looking for.
Thanks for all the assistance.
Torque Owner Badguy
Torque uses *.diff format
this format is somewhat like the traditional bsp format from quake but there are differences.
these structures are different they are not leak tested.
you do not run qvis on them.
basically the only tool run on the *.map is the csg type tool.
this map2diff tool simply converts the map format to the acceptable engine diff format.
this includes collision lighting entities and actual geometry.
in the engine it is operated like you state..
a structure sitting on the ground.
so in the Torque you will find a scene setup like this:
Terrain
SkyBox
Water
InteriorInstance
InteriorInstance
InteriorInstance
SceneObject
Player...
bleah bleah bleah
you can setup what you want here.. but there are things you will have to keep in mind..