Bad Topic for game... Your opinion

#1 What rock have you been under? :)

There are at least a DOZEN games out already ( especially consoles ) that are just that and they don't hide it either. Everything from FPS to RTS . . .

#2 Terrorism is a longstanding topic, especially with Tom Clancys hit games.

#3 Lol, thanks for clarifying that with me, it's just I got an e-mail from someone calling me an asshole for trying it...

and wanted to make sure that wasn't everyone's opinion.

#4 *Ahem*
I am the person in question here and I think you find I said this:

Quote:Sorry I disagree with ur game topic, and find your proposed release date to b in ill taste...

I never called you an asshole...



I would like to point out how Sam "forgot" to point out his intended release date (9/11/2004). I find this (in my opinion) to be inappropriate. Why not simply change ur game name and rename the countries etc involved? Just change stuff around a bit to stop the potential to offend anyone. (You cant please everyone, but at least try to please as many as you can...)

I just think that creating a game on this topic *could* be seen as demeaning to all the people who lost their lives in the past few years in relation to this.

Also, why not come up with an original idea? create your own setting? I'd find it much more gratifying to create my own world and conflict etc.

And please lets not start a thread on morality in video games, theres no point as its a cliched topic.

#5 You can't please everyone, and some people will go out of their way to find an extreme. Our hit mobile game recieved many such "insensitive" emails- apparently our little Snails are just terrorists in disguise. I can see their point to a certain extent, especially since we released our game just months after 9/11.

Regardless where the War on Terrorism takes place, in our own cities or in their cities, I think this SHOULD be covered.

#6 Oh I'd like to point out I didn't just send him a random email complaining. That email was me declining to join his team after he asked to see my work etc.

#7 Craig, I understand your opinions. But you don't have to buy, or play the game. In fact NO-ONE does. If too many find the game demeaning, sales will be dismal and the title will fade into oblivion. Or you can play into it like Grand Theft Auto 3, and actually fuel the sales into mega-stardom. Another example is the 2 Live Crew, who were virtually unknown on a worldwide scale, until Florida deemed them too explicit and tried to censor them. The media picked up on it and propelled them into superstardom.

The point is, people can take care of themselves, and decide for themselves what is inappropriate. How is this game any more demeaning than the 24 hour medai frenzy covereage? The Made-for-TV movies. The Documentaries? Many people have profited from this, and it sure as hell wasn't me.

#8 I totally agree that people can make their own choices. And I have made by choice by saying i dont want to work on a project such as that.

The only reaosn i bothered replying was because he said i called him an asshole... which i didn't. And i just wanted to clear up my views as he obviously misudnerstood me(?)

#9 Also, I found Sams question to be very straightforward. He didn't name names. He didn't mention a dev. He didn't point fingers. He didn't name specifics AT ALL.

In my opinion, he was very tasteful in his execution of this topic. He was just vague enough that people could expand in areas that that they MIGHT find distasteful. And his question was answered with just a few sentences.

So does this mean I shouldn't play Ghost Recon, Socom, Splinter Cell, or Counterstrike on 9/11 because I would be insensitive?

#10 However i liked the way he didn't include the release date in this thread that he told me... Because thats the bit i find particularly "crass"

I quote the word crass as this was said by someone else when i explained this to them...

Anywho - as i said before I wouldn't have even replied to this thread was it not for me having words put in my mouth by him.


Randall do you not think deliberately going for a 9/11 release date is wrong tho? Why not just release it when its done...

Lets just agree to disagree.

#11 Well since you specifically asked me, no, I don't find this deliberate release date offensive or wrong.

I used to live in New York City, within walking distance of the Twin Towers. Every morning, I would sit in my living room and just look at those massive towers while sipping my coffee. From our ten-story private terrace, we had an unobstructed view, and they were the single largest objects on the horizon. We went back last year, and I actually cried while we were standing at ground zero- everyone appeared to be in shock.

Now if a game could make me feel those kinds of emotions, I would buy it in a second, regardless what the content was.

#12 _MY_ opinion is that _I_ would find it offensive.

understand? I cant think of any other ways to word it cos you dont seem to get get it into ur head. The only reason i got involved in this thread was because he put words in my mouth.

I'm not gonna bother with this thread anymore as you are obviously just looking for an arguement. Which i wont lower myself to.

End of.

#13 I_Don't_Care

This thread isn't ABOUT you. Its about a game, and its potentially controversial content and marketing. Certainly you can maintain your opinion (this is what Sam requested), but you could have just come in acting like you had no prior knowledge of the game and then leave it at that. If Sam wants to fingerpoint and proclaim "THATS the asshole that sent me the email" then thats up to him. As of yet, he just left it alone.

#14 A 9/11 release date for a terrorism game isn't offensive, it's opportunism.
That's not necessarily a good thing -- I don't find it very respectful, myself.

As far as a terrorist game goes, I can see it as a useful way to vent and while it's not really my type of game, I do think it can be helpful and entertaining.

If the game was called Target: World Trade Center and the final goal to ram jets into two buildings, I might have something different to say.

Randal,

Quote:So does this mean I shouldn't play Ghost Recon, Socom, Splinter Cell, or Counterstrike on 9/11 because I would be insensitive?

That's your personal choice, and quite different than a company releasing a game.

Anyway, from my experience in the dev world, it won't be ready until Feb 14th, anyway. ;-)

-Eric F

#15 I personally find the current presentation of terrorism rather one-sided. Many people who are labelled terrorists are in reality just freedom fighters who are rebelling against governemnt terrorism and tyranny. Oftentimes, government tyrannies label certain dissenters as terrorists so that they can kill or detain them at their whim. Labeling an innocent person a terrorist is easy to do since people don't question or ask for proof - it gives government a completely free-hand to kill / incarcerate / torture dissenters at will. This is a grave injustice, and is used to violate human rights in many, many countries.

Sometimes it is difficult to tell which party is more extreme and murderous - tyranny government or terrorists.

As for the benefit of having a contraversial product, you'll be sure to get it with this. In fact, just this topic itself is probably going to be very contraversial. And at the very least, it won't be like the million other anti-terrorist games.

The world could use a bit of objectivity nowadays, I think.

#16 Starting up a "Save the Terrorists" fund, Bryan?

#17

Quote:Eric Forhan said -
Starting up a "Save the Terrorists" fund, Bryan?

Here's a great example of what I just mentioned. Mr. Forhan saw that I had a dissenting opinion, and decided to label me a terrorist sympathizer. This is a perfect example of what government does, and Mr. Forhan is the perfect example of people not questioning or thinking critically or requiring any proof of terrorist accusations.

This has got to stop. Someone needs to do something to stop the injustice of government terrorism.

All terrorism is evil, and terrorism should be brought to justice - most especially government terrorism. But before that happens, people have to see the reality, and a good interactive story might be able to do that.

#18 Actually, I agree with Bryan. As controversial as that topic may be, I think its something that we should all look into. TIE Fighter was an excellent game, and was even better with X-Wing vs TIE Fighter. For the first time, we got to play the bad guys, kick ass on the universe, all under the rule of the Emporer.

I can see it now. "Yeah, but those are fantasy."

What about the current crop of WWII games that allow you to play a role in the Nazi War Machine? I hardly think Battlefield 1942 would be worth playing without that.

THIS is why I don't have a single problem with anything Sam is doing. Anything that provokes thought is good in my book, regardless how dark and painful it may be.

Personally I'd be more concerned if there was a game called "KKK:Nigger Killer". Or "Newfoundland:Indian Slaughter". Or "DateRape:The Game". As scary as some of these titles are to some of you, I would be perfectly fine with the release of these titles- doesn't mean I have to play it or like it. It doesn't mean I agree with their theology or subject matter. It doesn't mean I promote those concepts.

So based on the immense popularity of Battlefield 1942, are we supposed to be concerned that there are an overwhelming number of Neo-Nazis and Nazi Sympathizers in our midst? I don't think so, and it isn't a cause for alarm.

#19 Well, to clarify, I wasn't suggesting a game where you actually play as a terrorist, rather you play the game where you are _accused_ of being a terrorist by the tyrant state. And because everyone just believes whatever the state says, they believe that you are a terrorist without a shred of evidence. Everyone, even your family and friends and lover would be turned against you after seeing your face on the evening news.

Interesting, contraversial, dramatic. All the makings of a good and enlightening story.

#20 Well, Bryan, your first post made it sound like you were trying to be empathetic toward terrorists. You've edited both posts more times than I can even keep track.

Now, I never made any connection to you and terrorists other than a "Save the children"-like comment.

All this empathy is well and good, except--hey... when a terrorist forgets to step into their victim's shoes.

And for the record, Bryan's first post was strictly anti-government rhetoric. Not one shred of a videogame reference.

-Eric F "That is, until he edits it again."