Turning an eye toward Torque
by Bryan Edds · in General Discussion · 10/15/2003 (3:09 am) · 13 replies
(proceeds to uncross his wandering eye by tilting his head to the opposite side...)
Ehem... Well, I can certainly say I'm a potential customer. But I have some unique concerns that I would be grateful to hear some responses to.
Firstly, I don't believe in scripting. I do all my work in the program code, and am wondering if Torque exposes all script functionality in the C++ API.
Second, I've not heard anything terribly good about Torque's API documentation - mainly that it is very incomplete. I am wondering if this is the case. Secondly, I am wondering why you don't make you documentation public for potential customer evaluation.
Thirdly, I am wondering if I can use 3DS Max with Torque.
Fourth, I would like to know all of Torque's features. I haven't been able to locate a comprehensive feature list anywhere. Again, a glance at the API would help me to know as well.
The only reason I have considered Torque is because my current engine is not being supported terribly well. Anyway, if anyone can help answer my concerns, I'd be grateful. Even if I don't buy Torque, I still appreciate the community and like to help where I can.
Ehem... Well, I can certainly say I'm a potential customer. But I have some unique concerns that I would be grateful to hear some responses to.
Firstly, I don't believe in scripting. I do all my work in the program code, and am wondering if Torque exposes all script functionality in the C++ API.
Second, I've not heard anything terribly good about Torque's API documentation - mainly that it is very incomplete. I am wondering if this is the case. Secondly, I am wondering why you don't make you documentation public for potential customer evaluation.
Thirdly, I am wondering if I can use 3DS Max with Torque.
Fourth, I would like to know all of Torque's features. I haven't been able to locate a comprehensive feature list anywhere. Again, a glance at the API would help me to know as well.
The only reason I have considered Torque is because my current engine is not being supported terribly well. Anyway, if anyone can help answer my concerns, I'd be grateful. Even if I don't buy Torque, I still appreciate the community and like to help where I can.
#2
And lastly, please refrain from being condescending towards me. Otherwise, your help is appreciated.
10/15/2003 (5:11 am)
The demo does not run on my computer (I have a pretty low-end setup), so unfortunately, it doesn't give me any of the info I need. Even if it did run, I don't imageine it would answer most of my questions - like whether or not the C++ API exposes all the functionality in the scripting modules.And lastly, please refrain from being condescending towards me. Otherwise, your help is appreciated.
#3
www.garagegames.com/pg/product/view.php?id=1
It is accessed via "Make Games > Torque Game Engine". Take a look at the bottom of the page, there is a fairly detailed feature list there. Including 3D tools that can be used along with exporters to create Torque objects.
The API documentation is much improved with the latest version, and both the script language and C++ portions have powerful and fast access to each other.
Oh, and definitely download the demo that Eric F mentioned above. About the SDK documentation - as far as I know, it isn't common practice to give access to product docs unless the product is free, or you have purchased a license. You may be able to see a sample of the docs, but that doesn't guarantee that the rest are of similar quality or detail.
-Darren.
EDIT: Sorry, just read that your computer won't run the demo. That's a shame, because it really does show what you get for your $100.
10/15/2003 (5:24 am)
May I direct you to this page:www.garagegames.com/pg/product/view.php?id=1
It is accessed via "Make Games > Torque Game Engine". Take a look at the bottom of the page, there is a fairly detailed feature list there. Including 3D tools that can be used along with exporters to create Torque objects.
The API documentation is much improved with the latest version, and both the script language and C++ portions have powerful and fast access to each other.
Oh, and definitely download the demo that Eric F mentioned above. About the SDK documentation - as far as I know, it isn't common practice to give access to product docs unless the product is free, or you have purchased a license. You may be able to see a sample of the docs, but that doesn't guarantee that the rest are of similar quality or detail.
-Darren.
EDIT: Sorry, just read that your computer won't run the demo. That's a shame, because it really does show what you get for your $100.
#4
UPDATE - Hey, this spec sheet answers a lot of my questions! Thanks for link, guys.
10/15/2003 (5:26 am)
Yeah, unfortunately the demo won't run on my PC - it crashes right out :( Strangely, I've never been able to get a Torque game to run on my PC properly. Do you think they'd be interested in the crash report?UPDATE - Hey, this spec sheet answers a lot of my questions! Thanks for link, guys.
#5
Are you running Windows? If so, which version of DirectX do you have installed? I think Torque requires DX8...
-Darren.
10/15/2003 (5:52 am)
You could try looking for the console.log file within the Torque directory (should be the same directory as the demo executable), that may contain some info about the crash.Are you running Windows? If so, which version of DirectX do you have installed? I think Torque requires DX8...
-Darren.
#6
But hey, I could generate a Dr. Watson if you'd find it useful.
10/15/2003 (5:54 am)
Win XP and DirectX 9 - its a really stable system, but just doesn't seem to like Torque code in particular. I'd bet its a bug in my display driver of my integrated, antiquated video card.But hey, I could generate a Dr. Watson if you'd find it useful.
#7
If you don't like scripting, I would strongly recommend that you stick with an engine that doesn't use it. If you can get realmwars or the demo to work you should play around with the scripting at least a little, though - I think you'll be pleasantly surprised if you give it a shot.
Still, if you can't get the Engine to run on your development hardware, that sort of answers your questions right there. ;)
10/15/2003 (6:05 am)
No, it would be the console.log file that would be useful, Dr. Watson not so much.Quote:Firstly, I don't believe in scripting. I do all my work in the program code, and am wondering if Torque exposes all script functionality in the C++ API.
If you don't like scripting, I would strongly recommend that you stick with an engine that doesn't use it. If you can get realmwars or the demo to work you should play around with the scripting at least a little, though - I think you'll be pleasantly surprised if you give it a shot.
Still, if you can't get the Engine to run on your development hardware, that sort of answers your questions right there. ;)
#8
As for my current hardware - bah, I'll be selling this piece of junk pretty soon anyways :P 3DS Max is just screaming for a computer with an actual AGP slot for a non-integrated video card.
10/15/2003 (6:12 am)
Yeah, maybe I'm being close minded. I guess scripting would be really useful with Torque level editor... so I'll probably be willing to change my ways.As for my current hardware - bah, I'll be selling this piece of junk pretty soon anyways :P 3DS Max is just screaming for a computer with an actual AGP slot for a non-integrated video card.
#9
//-------------------------- 10/15/2003 -- 09:30:47 -----
Processor Init:
Intel Pentium Celeron, ~500 Mhz
(timed at roughly 501 Mhz)
FPU detected
MMX detected
Math Init:
Installing Standard C extensions
Installing Assembly extensions
Installing FPU extensions
Installing MMX extensions
Input Init:
keyboard0 input device created.
mouse0 input device created.
DirectInput enabled.
--------- Loading MODS ---------
Compiling common/main.cs...
Loading compiled script common/main.cs.
Missing file: common/defaults.cs!
Compiling demo/main.cs...
Loading compiled script demo/main.cs.
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Loading compiled script demo/server/defaults.cs.
Missing file: demo/client/prefs.cs!
Missing file: demo/server/prefs.cs!
--------- Parsing Arguments ---------
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Video Init:
Accelerated OpenGL display device not detected.
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10/15/2003 (6:12 am)
Well, here's the log file -//-------------------------- 10/15/2003 -- 09:30:47 -----
Processor Init:
Intel Pentium Celeron, ~500 Mhz
(timed at roughly 501 Mhz)
FPU detected
MMX detected
Math Init:
Installing Standard C extensions
Installing Assembly extensions
Installing FPU extensions
Installing MMX extensions
Input Init:
keyboard0 input device created.
mouse0 input device created.
DirectInput enabled.
--------- Loading MODS ---------
Compiling common/main.cs...
Loading compiled script common/main.cs.
Missing file: common/defaults.cs!
Compiling demo/main.cs...
Loading compiled script demo/main.cs.
Compiling demo/client/defaults.cs...
Loading compiled script demo/client/defaults.cs.
Compiling demo/server/defaults.cs...
Loading compiled script demo/server/defaults.cs.
Missing file: demo/client/prefs.cs!
Missing file: demo/server/prefs.cs!
--------- Parsing Arguments ---------
--------- Initializing MOD: Common ---------
Compiling common/client/canvas.cs...
Loading compiled script common/client/canvas.cs.
Compiling common/client/audio.cs...
Loading compiled script common/client/audio.cs.
--------- Initializing MOD: Torque Demo ---------
Compiling demo/client/init.cs...
Loading compiled script demo/client/init.cs.
Compiling demo/server/init.cs...
Loading compiled script demo/server/init.cs.
Compiling demo/data/init.cs...
Loading compiled script demo/data/init.cs.
Compiling demo/data/terrains/highplains/propertyMap.cs...
Loading compiled script demo/data/terrains/highplains/propertyMap.cs.
--------- Initializing MOD: Torque Demo Server ---------
Compiling common/server/audio.cs...
Loading compiled script common/server/audio.cs.
Compiling common/server/server.cs...
Loading compiled script common/server/server.cs.
Compiling common/server/message.cs...
Loading compiled script common/server/message.cs.
Compiling common/server/commands.cs...
Loading compiled script common/server/commands.cs.
Compiling common/server/missionInfo.cs...
Loading compiled script common/server/missionInfo.cs.
Compiling common/server/missionLoad.cs...
Loading compiled script common/server/missionLoad.cs.
Compiling common/server/missionDownload.cs...
Loading compiled script common/server/missionDownload.cs.
Compiling common/server/clientConnection.cs...
Loading compiled script common/server/clientConnection.cs.
Compiling common/server/kickban.cs...
Loading compiled script common/server/kickban.cs.
Compiling common/server/game.cs...
Loading compiled script common/server/game.cs.
Compiling demo/server/scripts/commands.cs...
Loading compiled script demo/server/scripts/commands.cs.
Compiling demo/server/scripts/centerPrint.cs...
Loading compiled script demo/server/scripts/centerPrint.cs.
Compiling demo/server/scripts/game.cs...
Loading compiled script demo/server/scripts/game.cs.
--------- Initializing MOD: Torque Demo Client ---------
Compiling demo/client/ui/customProfiles.cs...
Loading compiled script demo/client/ui/customProfiles.cs.
Compiling common/client/message.cs...
Loading compiled script common/client/message.cs.
Compiling common/client/mission.cs...
Loading compiled script common/client/mission.cs.
Compiling common/client/missionDownload.cs...
Loading compiled script common/client/missionDownload.cs.
Compiling common/client/actionMap.cs...
Loading compiled script common/client/actionMap.cs.
Compiling common/editor/editor.cs...
Loading compiled script common/editor/editor.cs.
Compiling common/client/scriptDoc.cs...
Loading compiled script common/client/scriptDoc.cs.
Video Init:
Accelerated OpenGL display device not detected.
Accelerated D3D device not detected.
Voodoo 2 display device not detected.
"OpenGL" display device not found!
"OpenGL" display device not found!
"D3D" display device not found!
"Voodoo2" display device not found!
Compiling common/ui/defaultProfiles.cs...
Loading compiled script common/ui/defaultProfiles.cs.
Compiling common/ui/GuiEditorGui.gui...
#10
10/15/2003 (6:30 am)
It looks like your graphics card was undetectable(!)... What sort do you have? Can you run other OpenGL apps?
#11
10/15/2003 (6:46 am)
Quote:Yeah, maybe I'm being close minded. I guess scripting would be really useful with Torque level editor... so I'll probably be willing to change my ways.Good thing, cause the sort of power that scripts give you is immense. I dont know of a way to actually use torque without them. I think it is structured so that the C++ code provides classes and all the low level stuff, but you cant make a game out of it. The scripts join all the parts of the engine together to give you a game :D
#12
10/15/2003 (6:59 am)
Make sure that you're using the latest drivers from your card's manufacturer and not the compatability drivers from Windows updates.
#13
I think you'll find the GG community very helpful, but you also have to do some of the huntin' too. :-)
Yours was probably the fifth post--this week alone--that asked generally the same questions (except for the no-scripts thing).
I mean, just how hard is it to type "3DSMAX" in the search bar?
Nonetheless, apologies for the attitude, and good luck with your project.
-EricF
10/15/2003 (7:24 am)
Bryan, I don't mind helping... but when there's questions on easily obtainable answers, I'm not very thick-skinned. I think you'll find the GG community very helpful, but you also have to do some of the huntin' too. :-)
Yours was probably the fifth post--this week alone--that asked generally the same questions (except for the no-scripts thing).
I mean, just how hard is it to type "3DSMAX" in the search bar?
Nonetheless, apologies for the attitude, and good luck with your project.
-EricF
Torque 3D Owner Eric Forhan
Now, was that so hard? ;-)
-EricF