Hi, I'm Bryan Edds... and... I'm an indie game developer.
by Bryan Edds · in General Discussion · 08/13/2003 (4:22 pm) · 8 replies
I'm working with the Qube engine to make a 3-d tactical strategy game. Are there any Final Fantasy Tactics fans here? That is the genre in which I'm working.
My first question is - which game do you think would be more successful on the PC - a tactical strategy game that is like Final Fantasy Tactics, or a 3d game side-scrolling that is like Castlevania: Symphony Of The Night? I have an interest in doing both - though I believe the Castlevania-style game would take consderably less dev time (which is an important to an indieholic like me :))
My first question is - which game do you think would be more successful on the PC - a tactical strategy game that is like Final Fantasy Tactics, or a 3d game side-scrolling that is like Castlevania: Symphony Of The Night? I have an interest in doing both - though I believe the Castlevania-style game would take consderably less dev time (which is an important to an indieholic like me :))
#2
BTW: The Q3D engine is very impressive does it have netcode implemented yet? I hope my download will be finished soon (96Mb quite large).
thanx for the Q3D link
WCprof
08/13/2003 (8:27 pm)
Hi, I think I would prefer tactical first person shooters, but I think Final Fantasy is different and 3rd person.BTW: The Q3D engine is very impressive does it have netcode implemented yet? I hope my download will be finished soon (96Mb quite large).
thanx for the Q3D link
WCprof
#3
As for my question, I really don't think a 3D strategy game would be feasible for an indie such as myself. But on the other hand, I'm afraid there is no market for a Castlevania-type game on the PC - but on the other other hand - I believe that there will be a market when Konami stops producing side-scrolling Castlevania games... PLUS, I know that once people play the demo, they will be totally addicted and want to buy it... So right now, I'm thinking the 3D side-scrolling game... But I'll probably change my mind tomarrow... I keep going around and around in circles...
08/13/2003 (10:02 pm)
I'm not sure what, if any, net capabilites Q has. I plan on using another product for internet functionality. BUT, when Q 2.0 comes out (sometime in 2004-5) it should have all the net features you could want. The product is still a bit young - but its rate of progress is excellant. Just check out the management page to see the people in charge... ;)As for my question, I really don't think a 3D strategy game would be feasible for an indie such as myself. But on the other hand, I'm afraid there is no market for a Castlevania-type game on the PC - but on the other other hand - I believe that there will be a market when Konami stops producing side-scrolling Castlevania games... PLUS, I know that once people play the demo, they will be totally addicted and want to buy it... So right now, I'm thinking the 3D side-scrolling game... But I'll probably change my mind tomarrow... I keep going around and around in circles...
#4
I prefer a Castlevania like side-scroll game, with current 3D hardware
a side-scroll game can be improved from the traditional games we played in the SNES. Of curse, that's just my opinion.
I will check the Q engine, right now I'm working on my own game, but it will be finished in the next 3 or 4 months, if you want to make serious about doing that 3D side-scroll game (I was planning on doing a Megaman 2 clon, or a Ninja Gaiden clon) count me in.
Hagen
08/15/2003 (6:06 am)
Hey BryanI prefer a Castlevania like side-scroll game, with current 3D hardware
a side-scroll game can be improved from the traditional games we played in the SNES. Of curse, that's just my opinion.
I will check the Q engine, right now I'm working on my own game, but it will be finished in the next 3 or 4 months, if you want to make serious about doing that 3D side-scroll game (I was planning on doing a Megaman 2 clon, or a Ninja Gaiden clon) count me in.
Hagen
#5
As for the side-scrolling game, my biggest worry about making a side-scrolling 3D game is the amount of art necessary. So much scenery passes by so quickly, I'm afraid the background art would take a very long time to do. Have you thought any about this? In the 2D days, background creation was pretty quick with a tile-building program. Will I have to build a custom 3D tile engine, or will it be feasible to just do everything freehand in 3DS Max, and add in the details one object at a time?
08/15/2003 (1:29 pm)
Hey, it's great to see someone with a similar interest! Hey, can we get in contact?As for the side-scrolling game, my biggest worry about making a side-scrolling 3D game is the amount of art necessary. So much scenery passes by so quickly, I'm afraid the background art would take a very long time to do. Have you thought any about this? In the 2D days, background creation was pretty quick with a tile-building program. Will I have to build a custom 3D tile engine, or will it be feasible to just do everything freehand in 3DS Max, and add in the details one object at a time?
#6
08/15/2003 (4:57 pm)
I'd do a hybrid, a 2d parallax scrolling background, and 3d characters in front of it. In between you could have a layer of 3D objects and scenery that you need to interact with.
#7
08/15/2003 (10:16 pm)
That may be a workable solution. I'll have to try that and see what it looks like. I'll probably need to find someone who can fill the role of tile and texture artist, though. That might be tough. 
#8
I'm a bit of a Castlevania fan, and the 3D translations of the series have thusfar been abyssmal. Lament of Innocence may change that. A cross between Rygar (PS2) and Devil May Cry (PS2) would be your best bet for current CV fans (which are your marketbase, I'm assuming) since they've shown praise for both titles as what the 3D transition should be like. Most hated the N64 CV's with a passion, so the over-the-shoulder interface isn't probably your best bet for the simple reason that it was annoying to aim your whip...which is a staple in the CV series.
As for doing a 3D-2D game (ala Viewtiful Joe or Klanoa 2 or Pandemonium) you'd just need to figure out a camera track system to keep it lined up with the player. Then lay out your physical world using 3D objects for "depth" and a "3D look" while utilizing a 2D gameplay style. Then billboard your backgrounds or texture them along a back "wall" surface.
If you move in the CV direction, I'd recommend keeping it as close to a 2D game as possible or take it in a completely different direction (as Metroid Prime did taking Metroid from 2D to a first-person adventure title). But emphasise gameplay over nifty 3D graphics. That was the key failing point on the previous 3D CV games: they played like you were running on ice and attacking with sludge.
The background art assets will be a large undertaking as well since CV is known for its great backgrounds. A pseudo-RPG system like implemented in SOTN will have you modelling a few hundred weapons and effects as well.
As for a tactics-esque game, the art assets will be a huge undertaking, but balancing out the strategy system will be your main problem. Especially if you are looking at as deep of an advancement and job system. If that's the direction you're looking at, you may want to pick up Disgaea for research.
Just thought I'd add my $.02 (and edit my post so it appears that I can type).
10/21/2003 (3:37 pm)
While I liked the Qube engine, I noticed that it had major problems on standard graphics cards that are included in factory machines from Dell, Compaq, and Gateway. While it worked wonderfully on my GeForce 4 Ti, it was horrible or failed to run on lesser cards. That was one of the reasons that I haven't seriously considered it for development. It would be nice if I were planning on competing with Unreal 2004, but I have neither the money nor the crew to compete with such a title on limited hardware. If I did, I think I would use the CatMother engine rather than Qube anyway, but that's just personal preference for the code structure (though it does require T&L).I'm a bit of a Castlevania fan, and the 3D translations of the series have thusfar been abyssmal. Lament of Innocence may change that. A cross between Rygar (PS2) and Devil May Cry (PS2) would be your best bet for current CV fans (which are your marketbase, I'm assuming) since they've shown praise for both titles as what the 3D transition should be like. Most hated the N64 CV's with a passion, so the over-the-shoulder interface isn't probably your best bet for the simple reason that it was annoying to aim your whip...which is a staple in the CV series.
As for doing a 3D-2D game (ala Viewtiful Joe or Klanoa 2 or Pandemonium) you'd just need to figure out a camera track system to keep it lined up with the player. Then lay out your physical world using 3D objects for "depth" and a "3D look" while utilizing a 2D gameplay style. Then billboard your backgrounds or texture them along a back "wall" surface.
If you move in the CV direction, I'd recommend keeping it as close to a 2D game as possible or take it in a completely different direction (as Metroid Prime did taking Metroid from 2D to a first-person adventure title). But emphasise gameplay over nifty 3D graphics. That was the key failing point on the previous 3D CV games: they played like you were running on ice and attacking with sludge.
The background art assets will be a large undertaking as well since CV is known for its great backgrounds. A pseudo-RPG system like implemented in SOTN will have you modelling a few hundred weapons and effects as well.
As for a tactics-esque game, the art assets will be a huge undertaking, but balancing out the strategy system will be your main problem. Especially if you are looking at as deep of an advancement and job system. If that's the direction you're looking at, you may want to pick up Disgaea for research.
Just thought I'd add my $.02 (and edit my post so it appears that I can type).
Torque Owner Bryan Edds
http://www.qubesoft.com
And if you like it, please join the Yahoo! Q SDK group at -
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/qube_sdk_dev
- and make SURE to follow the special directions if you wish to successfully post messages at the Yahoo! group!