BLOG REMOVED
by Ron Kapaun · 02/03/2014 (3:11 pm) · 25 comments
THIS BLOG IS REMOVED BY THE AUTHOR. THANK YOU FOR VIEWING, SHARING AND DEBATING GAMES AND GAME DEVELOPMENT FOR NEARLY A DECADE. THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME AND EFFORT OVER THE YEARS. I SEND YOU ALL A MESSAGE OF HOPE THAT EVERYTHING YOU WISH TO ACCOMPLISH WILL COME TO PASS. I TRULY DO. GOOD LUCK, GOD SPEED AND MAY THE BUGS BE EASY TO HUNT, TRACK AND ELIMINATE. I WISH YOU ALL THE BEST OF LUCK. MAY ALL OF YOU ENJOY SUCCESS AND TRULY ENJOY GAME DEVELOPMENT FOR AS LONG AND AS FAR AS YOUR DREAMS, HOPES AND SKILLS CAN CARRY YOU.
RON
RON
About the author
Guy that has been with Torque Game Engines since... well, since here was a Torque Game Engine. (V12 and beyond).
#2
I've been using Unity for a while now, and I love it. But I feel like I'm cheating. Plus, running into the limitations of the 'indie' version of the product makes me miss the flexibility of Torque. I refuse to let go just yet.
You take care Ron, may your proverbial pastures be greener on the other side.
02/03/2014 (4:07 pm)
It's so sad but, I feel, also so true. Torque was my first love, as far as game engines go. It is difficult to see it, and GarageGames in the shape that they are in. I want it to be better. I want it to rise to a place of real competition with the other players again. I've got ideas (maybe delusions of grandeur?), but I'm no expert in anything, be it coding, marketing, directing, or anything else. I've been using Unity for a while now, and I love it. But I feel like I'm cheating. Plus, running into the limitations of the 'indie' version of the product makes me miss the flexibility of Torque. I refuse to let go just yet.
You take care Ron, may your proverbial pastures be greener on the other side.
#3
02/03/2014 (4:34 pm)
Take care Ron! 
#4
EDIT: I really wish engines like UDK would allow people to add C++. I'd be honestly able to provide MAP for them as well seeing as game authentication is honestly a big pain to any game. Unfortunately, they don't, and until other engines provide ways to incorporate external libraries, they'll be missing out. :)
02/03/2014 (5:06 pm)
I wish you the best of luck in your development progress, and you should be sure to know that we'll always still be here in the event things change for the better in the future.EDIT: I really wish engines like UDK would allow people to add C++. I'd be honestly able to provide MAP for them as well seeing as game authentication is honestly a big pain to any game. Unfortunately, they don't, and until other engines provide ways to incorporate external libraries, they'll be missing out. :)
#5
I myself am using Unity for a platformer game its easy to create such a game. But still T3D is better for FPS, I have been looking in to UDK again also. CryEngine still doesn't seem to have anything great for an Indie.
I hope GREED and OMNI can fill the void. I really want to put to use TAIK etc, but T3D as is does miss a lot of key game features that where key before it was named T3D.
02/03/2014 (5:13 pm)
Good luck Ron,I myself am using Unity for a platformer game its easy to create such a game. But still T3D is better for FPS, I have been looking in to UDK again also. CryEngine still doesn't seem to have anything great for an Indie.
I hope GREED and OMNI can fill the void. I really want to put to use TAIK etc, but T3D as is does miss a lot of key game features that where key before it was named T3D.
#6
Hi Ron Sorry to see U go U will be missed, Good Luck I hope all goes well for U, U r a great person and a awsome artiest and I love your work maybe when and if I change engine I will look up agian take care and agian good luck.
Terry
02/03/2014 (5:20 pm)
@RonHi Ron Sorry to see U go U will be missed, Good Luck I hope all goes well for U, U r a great person and a awsome artiest and I love your work maybe when and if I change engine I will look up agian take care and agian good luck.
Terry
#7
Will
02/03/2014 (6:06 pm)
Hey Ron, when are you releasing your goodies to the public? And whats in the bag of tricks your giving away? Take care man and good luck!Will
#8
While I won't take anything away from GG's current business model (it keeps them in business, which is the whole point!), I whole-heartedly agree that the spirit for which GarageGames stood for is a fire kept alive by a few old faithful followers like Ron, like me, like many others who still hang out around here.
Sadly, our business or lack thereof is not enough to keep GG spending resources on our beloved engines.
I'm still a fan of the technology. The MIT chapter of Torque tech is an amazing opportunity which has been embraced by too few people; that doesn't take anything away from the proposal imho.
Comparing it to Unreal, Unity and Crytek is a complicated affair as TxD is the only tech that comes with no strings attached and it's a GREAT opportunity for coders to learn how game engines are. It's also a great opportunity to learn how NOT to do certain things but that's the beauty of it, anyone is free to change it should they desire to do so.
Where do we sign up for the free assets?
@Andrew I don't hate Unity as a technology or as a game-making tool; T3D and T2D could sure use a few pointers from its workflow.
<Warning : Unity Rant>
That being said, the limitations on the 'free' version are absolutely retarded and make me want to hurt things; it makes Unity, which is being falsely touted as a 'free' game engine an incomplete product.
It's nothing but bait to get you to buy the 1500$ Pro version or 75$ a month. I jumped back into it when they've released their 2d add-on but the ANIMATION CURVES are a paying feature...and it won't tell you until you struggle with the engine for a few hours, trying to figure out just why this central feature doesn't seem to work.
And that's reason enough for me to never touch the thing again.
<Warning : End of Unity Rant>
Love UDK, though.
02/03/2014 (11:29 pm)
Ahh, Ron, you never fail to make posts entertaining :)Quote:)the idea behind Garage Games is tragically, lost
While I won't take anything away from GG's current business model (it keeps them in business, which is the whole point!), I whole-heartedly agree that the spirit for which GarageGames stood for is a fire kept alive by a few old faithful followers like Ron, like me, like many others who still hang out around here.
Sadly, our business or lack thereof is not enough to keep GG spending resources on our beloved engines.
Quote:God bless MIT licensing
I'm still a fan of the technology. The MIT chapter of Torque tech is an amazing opportunity which has been embraced by too few people; that doesn't take anything away from the proposal imho.
Comparing it to Unreal, Unity and Crytek is a complicated affair as TxD is the only tech that comes with no strings attached and it's a GREAT opportunity for coders to learn how game engines are. It's also a great opportunity to learn how NOT to do certain things but that's the beauty of it, anyone is free to change it should they desire to do so.
Where do we sign up for the free assets?
@Andrew I don't hate Unity as a technology or as a game-making tool; T3D and T2D could sure use a few pointers from its workflow.
<Warning : Unity Rant>
That being said, the limitations on the 'free' version are absolutely retarded and make me want to hurt things; it makes Unity, which is being falsely touted as a 'free' game engine an incomplete product.
It's nothing but bait to get you to buy the 1500$ Pro version or 75$ a month. I jumped back into it when they've released their 2d add-on but the ANIMATION CURVES are a paying feature...and it won't tell you until you struggle with the engine for a few hours, trying to figure out just why this central feature doesn't seem to work.
And that's reason enough for me to never touch the thing again.
<Warning : End of Unity Rant>
Love UDK, though.
#9
02/04/2014 (12:07 am)
Sorry to see you throw in the towel, Ron, but I totally get where you're coming from. Your blogs have always been a pleasure to read, and you've made some amazing stuff. Best of luck for the future! 
#10
02/04/2014 (1:36 am)
I think you're right Ron. Going MIT did kill Torque3D. Sorry to see you go, but I am thinking about the same move if things don't improve. 
#11
02/04/2014 (3:18 am)
I hope you are wrong Ron for the sake of us that remain with T3D. Good luck in your future endeavors and thank you for the work that you did on behalf of T3D. 
#12
02/04/2014 (3:21 am)
All the best Ron, for you new way! Sad to see and read this. 
#13
1. GG was going to end internal development of the Torque engines. That decision was made. What had to be decided was what to do with the engines. Close up sales and the site? Sell to another company? Open source? The thought was "We don't want Torque to die, but we can't keep it alive by ourselves. The best hope is to see if the world can keep it going."
While I understand why some users are calling it a day, especially former steering committee members, I think the open source effort still has a bit of gas left in it. However, that's totally up to the community to manage and figure out.
2.
It won't. Torque 2D has a lot going for itself. It's about to get a 3.0 release, editors, new steering committee members, and a shocking number of platform contributions from community members.
02/04/2014 (4:39 am)
Two points:1. GG was going to end internal development of the Torque engines. That decision was made. What had to be decided was what to do with the engines. Close up sales and the site? Sell to another company? Open source? The thought was "We don't want Torque to die, but we can't keep it alive by ourselves. The best hope is to see if the world can keep it going."
While I understand why some users are calling it a day, especially former steering committee members, I think the open source effort still has a bit of gas left in it. However, that's totally up to the community to manage and figure out.
2.
Quote:I truly hope that this situation does not happen with the T2D side of this engine
It won't. Torque 2D has a lot going for itself. It's about to get a 3.0 release, editors, new steering committee members, and a shocking number of platform contributions from community members.
Quote:God bless MIT licensing (with abundant sarcasm, since it was the WORST thing to happen since Instant Action).Bit of a stretch on that one =/. I think the worst thing that could have happened was a full shutdown of the engine, thus ending all Torque progress. Plus, the introduction of InstantAction to GarageGames wasn't the big problem, trust me on that as an insider.
#14
We are working on other project(s) using some of the other engines but Torque is were everything began for us (2005) so I guess that why I can't just leave it totally. Again good luck, and I'll be in touch.
02/04/2014 (4:59 am)
This is a sad day, seriously! Ron I do wish you the best as always! I do wish garagegames will decide something, that will benefit the engine for the future. Who knows maybe one day it'll reboot!We are working on other project(s) using some of the other engines but Torque is were everything began for us (2005) so I guess that why I can't just leave it totally. Again good luck, and I'll be in touch.
#15
To me it feels like T3D is just starting to get a foothold, it just IMO needs someone who will dictate it's development a bit and make the decisions.
But thats just me, I think it can be saved and I'd spend some time doing that if I weren't working on OMNI the little spare time I have, I'm sorry to let the community down tho :)
That been said, I totally understand you Ron! It's exhausting to see the T3D going nowhere. There is a lot of progress, but not enough of it is finished.
Hell I guess we need a shepherd, the only reason I finish my products is because Paul is writing to me every freaking day, poking me about the SSDO and sending me links to articles that could help me.
Good luck on your future endeavours! I hope the other engines can bring you some more joy, tho if I may, you should explore some other engines that provide access to the source. Going into Unity and suddenly hitting the "no customization" barrier is horrible, and hard to live with after having T3D :)
Heh I can recommend trying out OMNI (as any Winterleaf Entertainment employee would lol) when v1 goes live! Familiar code base, but much improved feature-wise. The core can barely be called T3D anymore.
02/04/2014 (5:42 am)
I don't know, is it just me or have there been more "noobs" on the forums this last month than there have been in a long time? To me it feels like T3D is just starting to get a foothold, it just IMO needs someone who will dictate it's development a bit and make the decisions.
But thats just me, I think it can be saved and I'd spend some time doing that if I weren't working on OMNI the little spare time I have, I'm sorry to let the community down tho :)
That been said, I totally understand you Ron! It's exhausting to see the T3D going nowhere. There is a lot of progress, but not enough of it is finished.
Hell I guess we need a shepherd, the only reason I finish my products is because Paul is writing to me every freaking day, poking me about the SSDO and sending me links to articles that could help me.
Good luck on your future endeavours! I hope the other engines can bring you some more joy, tho if I may, you should explore some other engines that provide access to the source. Going into Unity and suddenly hitting the "no customization" barrier is horrible, and hard to live with after having T3D :)
Heh I can recommend trying out OMNI (as any Winterleaf Entertainment employee would lol) when v1 goes live! Familiar code base, but much improved feature-wise. The core can barely be called T3D anymore.
#16
Edit: Oh and I too would like to thank you for all the effort you have done for the Torque community over the years.
And... Torque 3D MIT is not dead. Wait and see ;o)
02/04/2014 (7:10 am)
All the best for you RonEdit: Oh and I too would like to thank you for all the effort you have done for the Torque community over the years.
And... Torque 3D MIT is not dead. Wait and see ;o)
#17
02/04/2014 (8:26 am)
Good luck with your future projects, Ron.
#18
I think the engine (in the form of GREED) has a bright future, now that the old cruft and closed-source development blockers have split off or left the scene.
This was IMHO the problem from the beginning... open-source community development does not work well together with a app-store like sale of closed-source assets and code sniplets.
Open-source is all about collaborative development and improving a tool and not a product. The product is the game you create with the engine, not the engine itself.
All the best working with Unity though. It's definitly the best place to sell assets in a store right now.
02/04/2014 (8:55 am)
You are absolutely right, it should have been released under the GPL :pI think the engine (in the form of GREED) has a bright future, now that the old cruft and closed-source development blockers have split off or left the scene.
This was IMHO the problem from the beginning... open-source community development does not work well together with a app-store like sale of closed-source assets and code sniplets.
Open-source is all about collaborative development and improving a tool and not a product. The product is the game you create with the engine, not the engine itself.
All the best working with Unity though. It's definitly the best place to sell assets in a store right now.
#19
I'm a bit puzzled by this. The alternative was to let T3D die with v1.2. Even if the main T3D repo was to freeze right now (and it doesn't look like it will), there have been and will be games released with the MIT licensed version of T3D (I'm aware of a few companies using it). For me, that's a win!
- Dave
02/04/2014 (1:07 pm)
Good luck with your future developments, Ron!Quote:God bless MIT licensing (with abundant sarcasm, since it was the WORST thing to happen since Instant Action).
I'm a bit puzzled by this. The alternative was to let T3D die with v1.2. Even if the main T3D repo was to freeze right now (and it doesn't look like it will), there have been and will be games released with the MIT licensed version of T3D (I'm aware of a few companies using it). For me, that's a win!
- Dave
#20
Here is the blog where I make everything FREE (Public Domain):
http://www.garagegames.com/community/blogs/view/22577
Ron
02/04/2014 (6:26 pm)
Well thanks all... and as for the confusion/puzzling comments... well, sorry. I feel how I feel.Here is the blog where I make everything FREE (Public Domain):
http://www.garagegames.com/community/blogs/view/22577
Ron
Torque Owner Will Zettler
Digital Lightstorm Game Studio
Good luck on the move. I wish you the best of luck man. I really do. Your right, it feels like its dying off slowly. I put $505 in to Torque 3D when it first hit the market, and was a waste, to me for what I got then it was released for free. I hope it don't close anytime soon as I have a lot of products I've bought through them over the years, and wouldn't want to lose my serials and products.
Your right, Unreal and other engines have really shown the way compared to Torque. Hey I will admit they are trying, MIT isn't a total waste of effort. Lack of marketing has hurt the engine, I think. Just look at Unreal as a example of that. Unreal and Unity is everywhere and both platforms (PC and Android and Mac).
I'm about to move my content to those engines too. I have over 25 ambient packs that I would like to sell again. Maybe I'll see you out there someday here soon. I'm still working with TGB and Torque 3D in a small way. I still enjoy using them for my own personal happiness, even if its not to realise the next AAA game :-) Take care and best of luck and I hope it works out for you!
Will