Torque for the iPhone Licensing
by Brett Seyler · 08/21/2008 (12:13 am) · 68 comments
Well, we've mulled over a licensing model for our new iTorque (yes, that's the new name, thank you Raphael!) SDK long enough and we're finally ready to announce the licensing model and pricing. Thanks for all the feedback on the thread I posted earlier this week and for all the offers to help with development. We're nearing the level of documentation and ease of use where I think we'll be comfortable opening this up full bore at Indie prices soon, but for now, this is for pros / experts only. We want to ensure only those who won't be frustrated by commercial grade tools will be working with it at this stage, but don't worry, we're going to provide updates to both TGE and TGB on Mac / PC that will let you guys get going in earnest on Mac / PC right away targeting the 480x320 and 320x480 resolution outputs. Your current TGE and TGB project will accept these changes easily, so no worries about porting to these upcoming updates.
Here's what we're going to do:
Indie Licensing (non-transferable, per seat, for those licensees with less than $250k annual turnover)
For current owners of TGE:
$500 for the iTGE SDK and right to publish 1 title. $100 per title thereafter. No royalties, ever.
For current owners of TGB:
$500 for the iTGB SDK and right to publish 1 title. $100 per title thereafter. No royalties, ever.
Commercial Licensing (transferable, per seat)
For current owners of TGE:
$1000 for the iTGE SDK and right to publish 1 title. $500 per title thereafter. No royalties, ever.
For current owners of TGB:
$1000 for the iTGB SDK and right to publish 1 title. $500 per title thereafter. No royalties, ever.
As of now, we'll only be providing the SDK under the terms above to Commercial licensees, but we'll be opening it up under the Indie License and price very soon. Those who are participating in the ongoing development of the SDK will have rights to produce unlimited titles at no cost (thanks again to those of you helping speed this up). If any of you will be at PAX, come see us and we'll be showing some demo iTorque apps live. Cool stuff =)
FAQ
Q. How do I get iTorque?
A. Right now iTorque is only available under Commercial license. Indie licenses will be available shortly. Contact licensing@garagegames.com for more information or to purchase a license.
Q. I'm making a TGE / TGB game now. Will it work with iTGE / iTGB on the iPhone?
A. Yes. Nearly all TGE's features will be supported, but as always, you'll need to watch your memory and consider the hardware. The input mapping is obviously different as well, so you'll need to consider that in your game design.
Q. I want to buy a license for an unlimited number of developers / titles. Do you offer any other choices?
A. Yes. Studio licenses will start at $10k for the SDK and first title. An unlimited number of titles will be more. Contact licensing@garagegames.com for more details.
Q. I'm an Indie. Why can't I license iTorque at the Indie price now?
A. We're concerned that the product will be too difficult to work with for most amateur hobbyist developers at this stage, so only after we're satisfied that the documentation is solid and learning curve is not so steep will we roll this out under the Indie License.
Q. Will iTorque require a splash screen?
A. Yes.
Q. Will iTorque developers be able to share code resources on GG.com?
A. Yes. We'll make sure that the Torque community is free to work together on projects. We're working with Apple on this now. It may be a condition of the license agreement that you agree to post code / script resources on private forums only where other iTorque licensees have access.
Q. Will iTorque work with TGEA games? Will we ever see iTGEA?
A. Not at the moment. TGEA does offer some performance advantages, even at the fixed function level over TGE. The code is also cleaner and has been used by our studio more recently to produce games. The biggest advantage of TGEA over TGE, the advanced visual features like shaders and such, will not be portable to the iPhone though. The iPhone hardware won't support shaders. There may be reason in the future to deprecate these features in a port of TGEA to create an iTGEA though.
Q. Will iTorque work with Torque X / XNA games?
A. No. The iPhone uses an OpenGL ES graphics layer that's not at all compatible with Torque X or XNA.
Any other questions? Feel free to ask in the comments.
-Brett
About the author
Since 2007, I've done my best to steer Torque's development and brand toward the best opportunities in games middleware.
#42
08/26/2008 (6:34 pm)
Is there any word yet on the indy license? 
#43
I haven't heard one peep from them yet. Would be nice for a response by now. I've already started working with the TGB timed demo to lay out my game, and already have the payment for the Indie license on standby... hint hint.
08/27/2008 (10:10 am)
I've emailed them twice before the licensing prices were announced, and once more as soon as this posted.I haven't heard one peep from them yet. Would be nice for a response by now. I've already started working with the TGB timed demo to lay out my game, and already have the payment for the Indie license on standby... hint hint.
#44
That should relieve the absolute mountain of emails in my inbox for lots of you =) As a general heads up, TGB is further along than TGE. Both compile and render without errors on the device, but we haven't gotten to deep into optimization territory yet, so framerates for our standard demos like Behavior Shooter on TGB or starter.racing on TGE are not fast. However, with the graphics work done, the inputs mapped, and the other basics finished or nearly so, we're already seeing lots of cool stuff. From here we'll be focused on optimizations to get that stock framerate up and documentation. There are lots of ways to speed things up, mostly optimizing Torquescript for embedded devices, so in not too long, you should see TGE or TGB games coming over with only resizing the assets and running at good framerates.
08/27/2008 (6:08 pm)
Thanks for your patience thus far guys. We've got PAX this weekend, so I'm pretty swamped getting ready for that, but I'm trying to get ecommerce for the options outlined in this blog up on the site ASAP. The Indie licenses will be available for pre-order if you're so inclined. More details on the page once it's updated. That should relieve the absolute mountain of emails in my inbox for lots of you =) As a general heads up, TGB is further along than TGE. Both compile and render without errors on the device, but we haven't gotten to deep into optimization territory yet, so framerates for our standard demos like Behavior Shooter on TGB or starter.racing on TGE are not fast. However, with the graphics work done, the inputs mapped, and the other basics finished or nearly so, we're already seeing lots of cool stuff. From here we'll be focused on optimizations to get that stock framerate up and documentation. There are lots of ways to speed things up, mostly optimizing Torquescript for embedded devices, so in not too long, you should see TGE or TGB games coming over with only resizing the assets and running at good framerates.
#45
Ah, yes. And now it begins! Here is what we'd all like to know. What are the sales like on the iPhone for video games? Answer: Top selling crossword puzzle game earns the developer who wrote it $2,000.00 a day.
Wow. Like, awesome! Gimme a piece o that!
Feast your eyes on the sales numbers, me buckos...
www.taptaptap.com/blog/final-numbers-for-july/
9to5mac.com/iphone-apps-developers-rich
I dont know about you guys, but $2,000 a day would really help me pay the bills. Gas would be cheap by comparison to what I earn now.
08/27/2008 (7:02 pm)
Show me the money!Ah, yes. And now it begins! Here is what we'd all like to know. What are the sales like on the iPhone for video games? Answer: Top selling crossword puzzle game earns the developer who wrote it $2,000.00 a day.
Wow. Like, awesome! Gimme a piece o that!
Feast your eyes on the sales numbers, me buckos...
www.taptaptap.com/blog/final-numbers-for-july/
9to5mac.com/iphone-apps-developers-rich
I dont know about you guys, but $2,000 a day would really help me pay the bills. Gas would be cheap by comparison to what I earn now.
#46
It's encouraging to see even a niche app can make some decent money.
08/27/2008 (8:35 pm)
I'm not greedy. I'd settle for $500 a day :)It's encouraging to see even a niche app can make some decent money.
#47
08/27/2008 (8:39 pm)
@Britton, I think the more interesting question is, what do the less popular crossword puzzlers make per day? $0? :P
#48
To be honest I think we indies are looking at a total investment of $600.00 and some personal time with the TGB. The downside you dont sell anything, and lose 600 bucks. The upside is $2,000 a day. Even if its just one month its $60k. As Thomas Buscaglia says "that's a lot better than a sharp stick in the eye."
I wonder what the life span of the game sales would be. From what I've read retail is about 90 days.... . After 90 days in Retail Stores its a sharp decline. Online sales last a lot longer. (the Gararge Games model is much better than retail) The real question is what is the "shelf life" of a game on the iPhone? If this lasts a whole year Eliza will make about 720k off her crossword puzzle.
08/28/2008 (5:13 am)
@Ross, no they lose big money... atleast $100.00 dollars or more for the iPhone sdk purchased from apple. Plus all the time they spent developing the game. The TGB cuts the development time way down... To be honest I think we indies are looking at a total investment of $600.00 and some personal time with the TGB. The downside you dont sell anything, and lose 600 bucks. The upside is $2,000 a day. Even if its just one month its $60k. As Thomas Buscaglia says "that's a lot better than a sharp stick in the eye."
I wonder what the life span of the game sales would be. From what I've read retail is about 90 days.... . After 90 days in Retail Stores its a sharp decline. Online sales last a lot longer. (the Gararge Games model is much better than retail) The real question is what is the "shelf life" of a game on the iPhone? If this lasts a whole year Eliza will make about 720k off her crossword puzzle.
#49
I seriously doubt she'll be making the $2k/day for a whole year...it will probably ramp way down to next to nothing inside a month or two....
08/28/2008 (5:05 pm)
@Britton, well, $600 is a little low. You didn't factor in an iPhone (or iPod Touch), a Mac, the Apple fees...etc.I seriously doubt she'll be making the $2k/day for a whole year...it will probably ramp way down to next to nothing inside a month or two....
#50
08/28/2008 (5:13 pm)
You need a mac as well? Even via tgb/tge? :-O
#51
BTW Should we take this discussion to another post? I feel like we are all standing in line outside the GGStore waiting for new iTorque to come out :)
08/28/2008 (5:27 pm)
In the pc casual space (online portals) a top game (top 1-3 on the list) stays in the top 10 list for an avarage of 30 days. This is offcourse a very gross estimate, some games (very few) seats in the top 10 for 6 months or more. As soon as you are leaving the top 10 list it's "game over". Not sure how it works in the appStore since they have top 50 but I can't imagine it's much different. You either make it or you make another game. Preferebly both.BTW Should we take this discussion to another post? I feel like we are all standing in line outside the GGStore waiting for new iTorque to come out :)
#52
08/28/2008 (5:57 pm)
@Leroy, well you need one to use the Apple SDK, from what I understand (the simulator and what have you).
#53
08/28/2008 (6:31 pm)
@Ross: Thanks for the feedback. Is a mac needed even when developing via iTorque? Or can it be done on windows and/optionally a iPhone/iPod Touch? 
#54
But until we hear more, it would be safest to assume Mac + iPhone SDK, Objective-C and an iPhone/iPod Touch.
08/28/2008 (6:52 pm)
Not sure how exporting projects works, but it is safe to assume for now that it requires both the Apple SDK (to allow publishing in the store) and a Mac. There are some industrious people who have been jumping through hoops to getting the SDK to compile on Windows, but I'm not sure I would go that route unless you are already a whiz at makefiles, cross-compiling, etc. Somehwhat similar to many of the convoluted processes for creating homebrew console titles...but actually using the official SDK. I haven't seen anything on using the iPhone emulator on anything but a Mac, though. Others may have.But until we hear more, it would be safest to assume Mac + iPhone SDK, Objective-C and an iPhone/iPod Touch.
#55
Wishful thinking, probably, but it could happen. They'll sell more hardware if they do the port.
08/28/2008 (7:00 pm)
There is a possible bright light at the end of the tunnel (or it could be a dragon): Apple have already ported Cocoa and other components to get Safari over to Windows, and XCode is very modular already, plus porting the ARM variant of GCC isn't an impossible task for their programmers.Wishful thinking, probably, but it could happen. They'll sell more hardware if they do the port.
#56
Stop dreaming, get an iBook or iMac
08/28/2008 (8:15 pm)
And lose more Apple system sells (which is their main income beside itunes store).Stop dreaming, get an iBook or iMac
#58
08/29/2008 (1:43 am)
Thanks for clearing that up for me guys, I didn't realise you needed a mac too, although I should of, apple is a smart bunch of apples after all, boy they must be getting some serious increase in mac sells with the introduction of this sdk and off the back of the success of iPhone/iPod and the app store. You can't really knock their business acumen ;)
#59
08/29/2008 (2:09 am)
Remember you don't have to get a NEW mac there are really good deals on refurbished, old model macs that are only a generation old. Some as much as half off, and would work fine. Also the Mac mini is only $599 and is plenty of power for developing for iPhone.
#60
developer.apple.com/iphone/program/
developer.apple.com/iphone/
Now I will mention... this is for the pure iphone sdk. Who knows what the genius minds that produced the iTorque sdk have come up with. In my dreams, I build my simple mouse trap game on windows (with the TGB) then I plug in my iPhone to my pc, run the iTorque sdk compiler and install the game on my iPhone.
But, this is just in my dreams. I'm not sure how close to reality my vision is. I guess I do have to figure in the $200 for the iPhone. (I already bought one) But if my dream is correct then the total cost for entry (sans mac) is $800 for the indie.
Almost forgot (in my dream) the iTorque compiler runs on windows but produces an output file that iTunes or the Appstore can use to install the game on my iPhone.
So (in my dreams) with the iTorque SDK you can take anything you develop on windows and port it direct to the iPhone with no mac involved.
Since I'm dreaming... I'll go ahead and share the dream... my mouse trap game is a top seller. You can play online with your friends, they try to get your cheese. Its a super hit and I check the sales figures and I'm making $3,000 a day. Its so cool that everyone has to have it. The words "super cheese" is on everyone's lips. I make add ons where people can share their mouse traps. I host world tournaments and every add on sells for $2,000 a day. After 5 add ons I'm making 10,000 a day, and thats before its goes to the European market. Sales snow ball and before the year is up I've made 2 million dollars. I quit my day job, and start game programming full time. I hire a staff, and buy a new dodge viper... then well .... then I wake up .... its just a dream.... or is it?
I'd really like to see how the iTorque sdk works with the TGB. Its perfectly feasible that this is where torque triumphs over the apple sdk. It might just be true that with TGB and iTorque its now possible develop games on windows for the iPhone.
.
08/29/2008 (5:52 am)
@Roney, Marc, Leroy, James and Ross, I think you do have to have a mac. I have heard "rumors" of an iPhone emulator for windows. But the straight skinny from apple seems to indicate that... yeah you need a mac.developer.apple.com/iphone/program/
developer.apple.com/iphone/
Now I will mention... this is for the pure iphone sdk. Who knows what the genius minds that produced the iTorque sdk have come up with. In my dreams, I build my simple mouse trap game on windows (with the TGB) then I plug in my iPhone to my pc, run the iTorque sdk compiler and install the game on my iPhone.
But, this is just in my dreams. I'm not sure how close to reality my vision is. I guess I do have to figure in the $200 for the iPhone. (I already bought one) But if my dream is correct then the total cost for entry (sans mac) is $800 for the indie.
Almost forgot (in my dream) the iTorque compiler runs on windows but produces an output file that iTunes or the Appstore can use to install the game on my iPhone.
So (in my dreams) with the iTorque SDK you can take anything you develop on windows and port it direct to the iPhone with no mac involved.
Since I'm dreaming... I'll go ahead and share the dream... my mouse trap game is a top seller. You can play online with your friends, they try to get your cheese. Its a super hit and I check the sales figures and I'm making $3,000 a day. Its so cool that everyone has to have it. The words "super cheese" is on everyone's lips. I make add ons where people can share their mouse traps. I host world tournaments and every add on sells for $2,000 a day. After 5 add ons I'm making 10,000 a day, and thats before its goes to the European market. Sales snow ball and before the year is up I've made 2 million dollars. I quit my day job, and start game programming full time. I hire a staff, and buy a new dodge viper... then well .... then I wake up .... its just a dream.... or is it?
I'd really like to see how the iTorque sdk works with the TGB. Its perfectly feasible that this is where torque triumphs over the apple sdk. It might just be true that with TGB and iTorque its now possible develop games on windows for the iPhone.
.
Torque Owner Dale Best
I cant wait to start playing around with this. Hand held console development for everybody!
Interesting article, a couple of weeks old, but definitely worth the read:
www.eurogamer.net/article.php?article_id=212436
Nice :-)