Indie Game Assets
by John Spivey · 10/17/2007 (8:45 am) · 11 comments
After years (yes YEARS) of playing with Torque I have learned many things. My most recent revelation is that I am not a programmer. I am much much better at game art. This brings me to another mini-revelation. The Torque Community needs some kind of inexpensive way to obtain game assets for their projects. Art is my field, more specifically world building. There are many other forms of game assets that people need.
There are people out there that just like to write code that could not build a castle wall to save their life. There are modelers out there that could give a hoot about scripts. I still have not seen much in the lines of killer particles (AFX pack excluded of course) Especially the people who are just in this as a hobby, like me. If there are people out there like me, which I am sure there are, then they are fairly skilled in their area and have something to offer. I hope to get those people an outlet for their labor of love. Sure money is nice but imagine if someone released a game with your stuff in it. Yeah that would be great.
So what is the solution here? Well thats what I am writing this blog here for.
I am currently in the process of setting up a web site where people can submit game assets to be sold at VERY reasonable prices. I liken it to TurboSquid. However TurboSquid is really not set up for Indie's on a budget. There is so much stuff to be sold there at, what I consider to be, insane prices.
"...game assets for the working class."
I don't want to throw out the URL just yet because I don't want some wise guy snagging it up before I have secured everything I need.
The premise is quite simple. You have assets sitting on your computer that are really doing nothing. There are people in the community that would drool all over your stuff. Why not let them purchase the assets, make a little scratch, and everyone is happy? Now keep in mind that this is not intended to be a cash cow for yours truly. Also I would not expect you to be able to quit your day job on the earnings. If I can manage to keep the site alive with money made then the site stays alive. Anything extra will just be icing on the cake.
The pricing formula I wish to follow is this. If you make some form of asset, whatever that asset would be, you simply divide it by ten (10) and there is your price for sale. So if you spend 3 hours on a model and you feel that your time and effort is worth say $10 an hour then the model to you is worth $30.00. So when you submit the model you tell me that you feel the model is worth 30 bucks. If its agreeable then the site automatically assumes that ten people will buy the model. The model sells for $3.00. All sales would be split 50/50. Half for designer, half for the host site. The host site will absorb all transaction fees associated with the sales. Its a fairly standard rate.
Keeping prices low is entirely what the site is all about. This way developers don't have to plan too terribly much for purchases. I have put together some numbers on my end and so far I am not convinced that there is enough money to be made in keeping a site like this. BUT the wife gave the green light on start up funds so the ball is rolling. It sounds like a great way to get assets out there.
This is in no way associated with GG's, partners, or anything. Thats not to say that I am not interested in such things. Its just a disclaimer to let people know that this is a separate entity.
What I need from the community is a general nod of approval and any input that you all might have to offer. There will be more to come in the lines of particulars for the site once it is fully integrated, MB set up and things of that nature.
Let the comments/flames begin.
There are people out there that just like to write code that could not build a castle wall to save their life. There are modelers out there that could give a hoot about scripts. I still have not seen much in the lines of killer particles (AFX pack excluded of course) Especially the people who are just in this as a hobby, like me. If there are people out there like me, which I am sure there are, then they are fairly skilled in their area and have something to offer. I hope to get those people an outlet for their labor of love. Sure money is nice but imagine if someone released a game with your stuff in it. Yeah that would be great.
So what is the solution here? Well thats what I am writing this blog here for.
I am currently in the process of setting up a web site where people can submit game assets to be sold at VERY reasonable prices. I liken it to TurboSquid. However TurboSquid is really not set up for Indie's on a budget. There is so much stuff to be sold there at, what I consider to be, insane prices.
"...game assets for the working class."
I don't want to throw out the URL just yet because I don't want some wise guy snagging it up before I have secured everything I need.
The premise is quite simple. You have assets sitting on your computer that are really doing nothing. There are people in the community that would drool all over your stuff. Why not let them purchase the assets, make a little scratch, and everyone is happy? Now keep in mind that this is not intended to be a cash cow for yours truly. Also I would not expect you to be able to quit your day job on the earnings. If I can manage to keep the site alive with money made then the site stays alive. Anything extra will just be icing on the cake.
The pricing formula I wish to follow is this. If you make some form of asset, whatever that asset would be, you simply divide it by ten (10) and there is your price for sale. So if you spend 3 hours on a model and you feel that your time and effort is worth say $10 an hour then the model to you is worth $30.00. So when you submit the model you tell me that you feel the model is worth 30 bucks. If its agreeable then the site automatically assumes that ten people will buy the model. The model sells for $3.00. All sales would be split 50/50. Half for designer, half for the host site. The host site will absorb all transaction fees associated with the sales. Its a fairly standard rate.
Keeping prices low is entirely what the site is all about. This way developers don't have to plan too terribly much for purchases. I have put together some numbers on my end and so far I am not convinced that there is enough money to be made in keeping a site like this. BUT the wife gave the green light on start up funds so the ball is rolling. It sounds like a great way to get assets out there.
This is in no way associated with GG's, partners, or anything. Thats not to say that I am not interested in such things. Its just a disclaimer to let people know that this is a separate entity.
What I need from the community is a general nod of approval and any input that you all might have to offer. There will be more to come in the lines of particulars for the site once it is fully integrated, MB set up and things of that nature.
Let the comments/flames begin.
About the author
#2
I hope you follow through with the project, and build it into a polished site with reputable assets. I buy most of my content from GG's content store, because I know what I'm going to get is going to meet at least some minimum bar of quality. Shoot for that or better.
I've used Turbosquid quite a bit as well, and so if that's your model it certainly seems a good one.
In terms of assets themselves, I would love to see more character models that use the evolving standard of Kork/Adam/Ava skeleton and animations -- and more animations themselves that use these assets. 3D models are a dime a dozen. And textures are in abundance anywhere. But try to find some animations for your character, or a character that can use your existing animations, and you're screwed. And the less time you have to spend wrangling with importers and exporters -- from a development standpoint, the better.
So good 'on ya! And good luck! Can't wait for the store to open! :)
10/17/2007 (9:28 am)
So, as a programmer who's not an artist, and is reliant almost entirely upon stock assets, can I just say HUZZAH!!!I hope you follow through with the project, and build it into a polished site with reputable assets. I buy most of my content from GG's content store, because I know what I'm going to get is going to meet at least some minimum bar of quality. Shoot for that or better.
I've used Turbosquid quite a bit as well, and so if that's your model it certainly seems a good one.
In terms of assets themselves, I would love to see more character models that use the evolving standard of Kork/Adam/Ava skeleton and animations -- and more animations themselves that use these assets. 3D models are a dime a dozen. And textures are in abundance anywhere. But try to find some animations for your character, or a character that can use your existing animations, and you're screwed. And the less time you have to spend wrangling with importers and exporters -- from a development standpoint, the better.
So good 'on ya! And good luck! Can't wait for the store to open! :)
#3
Sounds a little like the iStockPhoto model (a little different than the Turbosquid model), saw this applied recently to www.flashden.net. Some pretty good quality stuff there for very reasonable prices. There is a market gap for something similar in community driven paid content generation.
The per item costs and the developers share are pretty small $$, as the site owner takes a cut. But it's a way to get things published on a smaller scale pretty quickly and easily.
I'd recommend separating it into strata though. For example, the lower strata would give everyone regardless of talent or quality a spot to share their wares. As you filter upwards in the strata, you would expect the quality and the price to go up a bit. The Indie community is all about having the opportunity to build stuff - the spirit of the community would dictate that this should also apply to any community service / driven toolset.
Steve
10/17/2007 (9:44 am)
Hey John,Sounds a little like the iStockPhoto model (a little different than the Turbosquid model), saw this applied recently to www.flashden.net. Some pretty good quality stuff there for very reasonable prices. There is a market gap for something similar in community driven paid content generation.
The per item costs and the developers share are pretty small $$, as the site owner takes a cut. But it's a way to get things published on a smaller scale pretty quickly and easily.
I'd recommend separating it into strata though. For example, the lower strata would give everyone regardless of talent or quality a spot to share their wares. As you filter upwards in the strata, you would expect the quality and the price to go up a bit. The Indie community is all about having the opportunity to build stuff - the spirit of the community would dictate that this should also apply to any community service / driven toolset.
Steve
#4
@Steve- I plan on including a MB for people to provide "constructive" comments on particular contributers. That way people will have some idea as to the quality of items that person provides. There wont be room for "You suck" posts but I think you get what I mean. Idealy "rate this product" option would be perfect. Not sure if that will come in the package I am looking at though.
@Devon- I totally understand where you are comming from with the animations for player characters and things of that nature. There are some options but with stock torque the .dts and corresponding .dsq's have to meet very specific criteria and that is probably why people are not pushing out models left and right. Not my speciality but definatly available. I expect the developers of such things would require a considerable fee even at the low range for such work.
Keep in mind that audio tracks are also a viable solution. Hell if Itunes charges 99 cents for a song then I see no reason that we could not put together such things at a comptetitive rate =).
10/17/2007 (10:08 am)
Wow, I go away for 30 minutes and already have responses. (puts down the hot pockets)@Steve- I plan on including a MB for people to provide "constructive" comments on particular contributers. That way people will have some idea as to the quality of items that person provides. There wont be room for "You suck" posts but I think you get what I mean. Idealy "rate this product" option would be perfect. Not sure if that will come in the package I am looking at though.
@Devon- I totally understand where you are comming from with the animations for player characters and things of that nature. There are some options but with stock torque the .dts and corresponding .dsq's have to meet very specific criteria and that is probably why people are not pushing out models left and right. Not my speciality but definatly available. I expect the developers of such things would require a considerable fee even at the low range for such work.
Keep in mind that audio tracks are also a viable solution. Hell if Itunes charges 99 cents for a song then I see no reason that we could not put together such things at a comptetitive rate =).
#5
This would be a great resource to add to the community. I have seen, and in some cases even been personally involved with, at least 4 similar projects. From my experience I have found it is a lot less about what system you build or what business model you choose and a lot more about persistence, follow-through and connectedness. Basically, if you build a better mouse trap people will NOT beat a path to your door. You have to go out with a megaphone and drag people in to look, day in and day out. As you wrestle with the immediate (and solvable even for an artist) challenges of building a site that works, keep in mind the long road of nurturing it -- without constant love and care it will never grow.
Scott (who gives his stuff away)
www.lowpolycoop.com
PS. If you build a section for freebies, let me know.
10/17/2007 (1:24 pm)
Hi John,This would be a great resource to add to the community. I have seen, and in some cases even been personally involved with, at least 4 similar projects. From my experience I have found it is a lot less about what system you build or what business model you choose and a lot more about persistence, follow-through and connectedness. Basically, if you build a better mouse trap people will NOT beat a path to your door. You have to go out with a megaphone and drag people in to look, day in and day out. As you wrestle with the immediate (and solvable even for an artist) challenges of building a site that works, keep in mind the long road of nurturing it -- without constant love and care it will never grow.
Scott (who gives his stuff away)
www.lowpolycoop.com
PS. If you build a section for freebies, let me know.
#6
10/17/2007 (1:31 pm)
Sounds quite familiar ;) This concept is popping up more and more. Good luck John!
#7
There are however places with much better support, pricing and quality. Such as www.3drt.com. I highly respect what they have to offer.
Alas... I like your idea, and would like to see what you have to offer. So good Luck :)
10/17/2007 (1:56 pm)
I cant agree more with you about prices being insane on Turbosquid. I think the artist who post there read it Turbo Quid.There are however places with much better support, pricing and quality. Such as www.3drt.com. I highly respect what they have to offer.
Alas... I like your idea, and would like to see what you have to offer. So good Luck :)
#8
Ok so how do you figure out your cut of the profits?
I have been thinking about that and many have concerns about what is indeed a fair price. So it will come down to the value of what you are selling. The sale amount will determine my percentage of the sales. The more involved and valuable the asset being sold the lower the percentage I receive.
Sales--------ranks-----Percentage
$1-$20------Rank 1---50% to designer 50% to indiedevzone.com
$21-$40----Rank 2----65% to designer 35% to indiedevzone.com
$41-$100---Rank 3----80% to designer 20% to indiedevzone.com
$100 +------Rank 4----85% to designer 15% to indiedevzone.com
After ten (10) sales at the standard rank designation all models excluding rank 4 items will be given a rank 3 designation. So if you sell 10 of an individual asset then all sales following that tenth sale will be given rank 3 status.
This is about the best solution I can manage. Essentially if your assets sell then you get a higher percentage. Also you get a higher percentage if your provide "substantial" content that is of great value.
@ Scott- It is highly unlikely that there will be a "freebies" section. I do not wish to belittle the efforts of anyone by not giving them something in return. Its great to help out and donate some work. Shoot. If I still had all the art assets that I have done that was given to specific teams I would have a great deal of items to sell.
10/17/2007 (3:16 pm)
Well I have recieved comments about the payment options and I think I have come up with a viable solution. People seem quite upset over the site making money but after dropping the chunk of cash that I have done so far there is no other alternative other than to charge. This is my current payment method. Keep in mind that all transaction fees and site fees are still on me. All the contributers need do is provide the forms and submit. Thats all. This is from the site's FAQ's.Ok so how do you figure out your cut of the profits?
I have been thinking about that and many have concerns about what is indeed a fair price. So it will come down to the value of what you are selling. The sale amount will determine my percentage of the sales. The more involved and valuable the asset being sold the lower the percentage I receive.
Sales--------ranks-----Percentage
$1-$20------Rank 1---50% to designer 50% to indiedevzone.com
$21-$40----Rank 2----65% to designer 35% to indiedevzone.com
$41-$100---Rank 3----80% to designer 20% to indiedevzone.com
$100 +------Rank 4----85% to designer 15% to indiedevzone.com
After ten (10) sales at the standard rank designation all models excluding rank 4 items will be given a rank 3 designation. So if you sell 10 of an individual asset then all sales following that tenth sale will be given rank 3 status.
This is about the best solution I can manage. Essentially if your assets sell then you get a higher percentage. Also you get a higher percentage if your provide "substantial" content that is of great value.
@ Scott- It is highly unlikely that there will be a "freebies" section. I do not wish to belittle the efforts of anyone by not giving them something in return. Its great to help out and donate some work. Shoot. If I still had all the art assets that I have done that was given to specific teams I would have a great deal of items to sell.
#9
Sounds like overall a good idea, but I'm wondering what the incentive would be to sell an asset at your site. I mean if you make a model, and it really is worth $30 like in your example, and will sell for $30 say on turbosquid or in the GG store, why would someone sell it for $3 (and net $1.50) on this site?
The second comment is that in your sales-rank-percentage table seems to contradict the premise for this store. Your sliding scale would definitely encourage people to round their prices up to the next "quanta" rather than down. For example, if someone is debating what price point to sell their pack, and they think a good price point is $60-$80, they'd be wise to start it at $100 because of the sliding scale, rather than say pricing it at $50. It seems to me that to be consistent with the goals you state for this site, the scale should slide in the opposite direction shouldn't it?
10/18/2007 (8:04 am)
John,Sounds like overall a good idea, but I'm wondering what the incentive would be to sell an asset at your site. I mean if you make a model, and it really is worth $30 like in your example, and will sell for $30 say on turbosquid or in the GG store, why would someone sell it for $3 (and net $1.50) on this site?
The second comment is that in your sales-rank-percentage table seems to contradict the premise for this store. Your sliding scale would definitely encourage people to round their prices up to the next "quanta" rather than down. For example, if someone is debating what price point to sell their pack, and they think a good price point is $60-$80, they'd be wise to start it at $100 because of the sliding scale, rather than say pricing it at $50. It seems to me that to be consistent with the goals you state for this site, the scale should slide in the opposite direction shouldn't it?
#10
10/18/2007 (6:17 pm)
Well in an effort to keep this thread from going the same way some others have. Pricing models are being tweaked on and I will do everything I can to keep the contributer happy with as much money as I can but people really have to understand that this involves a sizeable investment. That being said, I am hopefull that people will move on to possibly talking about things that they would like for such a site.
#11
10/21/2007 (3:30 pm)
Good luck... I've always wondered if there was a market for this.. there are a large number of hobby programmers that would love some artwork to complete their projects... but the pricing would have to be REAL low.. like a whole set of pacman images for $7 or something. The hobbiest is hard pressed to spend $100 on the engien.. they aren't going to spend $50 on a graphic set. I've read other blogs where art assets were given away free since no one was buying them for $25 or so... 
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