Hobbyist Pricing - Digital Shock Outsourcing
by Thanhda Tie · 01/06/2010 (3:44 pm) · 58 comments
Introduction
Hi guys, this is Thanhda from Digital Shock. As some of you already know, we are offering 2D & 3D Contract artwork through the TorquePowered Store. This week I will be going over our new Hobbyist pricing, showing you how you can save money.SEASONS GREETINGS FROM DIGITAL SHOCK!!!
As another successful year for gaming rolls by we decided to sip on some eggnog and shake things up a little bit. As you know Digital Shock has quite a presence not only in North America but internationally as well. With that said this holiday season we are giving back to the Indie Guys. Why? Because large corporations like INSTANT ACTION, UBISOFT, DIGITAL SHOCK, ACTIVISION, NGMOCO etc… all started somewhere. In fact it’s the collaboration of innovation across all game developers big and small that keep this industry alive and strong. So in light of the innovation of our Indie friends world wide we are introducing our Indie vs. Hobbyist program.
Q. How Does It Work?
A. As you already know Digital Shock has some of the most competitive rates along with some of the best quality in the gaming world today. So to help the little guy out with a big dream but smaller budget we decided to drop our art prices to $20 USD per man-hour.
Q. How can such a large studio like yourself afford to give such a great rate? Do you still make profit?
A. The average artist gets paid roughly $60k per year, which in turns out to be $29 USD per man hour. So in a sense Digital Shock is taking a loss to give the hobbyist a chance to make a game.
Q. This doesn’t make any sense, how does Digital Shock make money? What’s the Catch?
A. We don’t like to look at this as a catch, more so the deal, how this works is simple. Digital Shock and the client will negociate a flat rate base on the scope of the project. At which point the client will only have to pay $20 USD per man-hour and will have a set time agreed upon to pay the remaining balance. Otherwise Digital Shock will have the rights to re-sell this product to the community to mitigate its losses.
We find that this method would be very effective to the hobbyist community. Many hobbyist projects don’t go too far, but end up more so as a portfolio piece to get themselves into the industry. We are giving a chance for the hobbyist to make their game come to life, without making themselves bankrupt. Giving them a chance to scrap the project without having to worry about spending an arm and a leg.
Q. Is there a restriction to this license agreement?
A. This license agreement will be similar to the content pack commercial license. You can do whatever you want on it, but! re-sell it as a content pack.
Q. Do I have to use Torque Engine to take advantage of this deal?
A. No, this deal is for anyone who request a quote through the Torque Powered Store.
Q. This is amazing pricing, but how much do other studios charge in-comparison?
A. Well first of all, no other studio is offering this special. Digital Shock is a commercial studio production house. We compare ourselves to bigger studios such as Red Jade, Massive Black, or Shadow In Darkness. These studios charge anywhere from $50 USD per man hour to $100 USD per man hour and pay their employees ranging from $60k to $100k a year. If you are not a hobbyist and would like to talk more details on our indie/commercial pricing. Please contact us for a quote.
Q. What services apply to this Hobbyist pricing?
A. Everything we offer except for concept art or illustration work. Unfortunately we can not mitigate our losses by selling concept art/illustration work on the Torque Powered store. So we pretty much only offer this discount for 3D models that need to be made from ground up. This rate will not apply for just texture work, or just modeling work.
Q. How long does it take to make a model?
A. You can find yourself a rough estimation Here. This is calculated in man-days. 1 man-day = 8 man-hours. Remember this is still just a rough estimation, so sending in a quote request is still good to do. Prices always varies depending the art asset itself.
Q. Coming up next blog.. Community Art Packs?
A. Find out more next blog!
In the meantime, check out our Demo Reel
Digital Shock Product Page
You can also see our wider portfolio @ DigitalShock.net
Q. I'm not a hobbyist
A. Check out our previous blog Here
PLEASE NOTE: If you send a request, please note that you are looking for Hobbyist Pricing
Who we have worked for
#2
perhaps the next time i end up in a time crunch i will give you guys another go with this new price tier, though hopefully perhaps you guys can come up with an easier more cost efficient method for payment that would be mutually benificial for you and your potential customers.
01/06/2010 (5:15 pm)
I got to say, while your original pricing was high I didnt have much of an issue with it provided it was a high quality product, which your demo real indicates it would be. what i had a bigger issue with is the Wire transfer only payment option, fees when sending money via a wire tranfer especially when sent international are steep, I believe when i looked into it it ended up being an adittional $70 to send a wire transfer through my bank (bank fees for transfers from what i looked into vary from $40-$100 plus for international transfers) from California to canada, another method of payment would be great, though with the new hobbiest pricing this doesnt cut as bad. but when you are already asking $500 plus for something simple like a pencil concept(based on i believe the indie pricing, it was NOT this new price range) dropping another $70 is the difference between a sale and a no sale at least for me it was i would just as well do the work myself...but thats just my opinion, perhaps the next time i end up in a time crunch i will give you guys another go with this new price tier, though hopefully perhaps you guys can come up with an easier more cost efficient method for payment that would be mutually benificial for you and your potential customers.
#3
Indie pricing has not dropped. This is a new pricing for Hobbyist. I understand that wire-transfer fees can get expensive, and we too have a cost we have to pay for such transfers. The only other method of payment we would consider would be money orders, this is usually not preferred since it takes time to mail it out.
We are more so expecting the community to make more bulk orders vs small orders. This will save them time and money from wire-transfers.
01/06/2010 (5:29 pm)
@KennethIndie pricing has not dropped. This is a new pricing for Hobbyist. I understand that wire-transfer fees can get expensive, and we too have a cost we have to pay for such transfers. The only other method of payment we would consider would be money orders, this is usually not preferred since it takes time to mail it out.
We are more so expecting the community to make more bulk orders vs small orders. This will save them time and money from wire-transfers.
#4
1) What are the qualifications for Hobbiest status versus Indie?
2) In your statement below, this sounds like the amount charged will actually be more than $20 an hour, because if you are paying for the hours as you go, why would there still be a balance after that?
"At which point the client will only have to pay $20 USD per man-hour and will have a set time agreed upon to pay the remaining balance. Otherwise Digital Shock will have the rights to re-sell this product to the community to mitigate its losses. "
01/06/2010 (6:46 pm)
@Thanhda, I have two questions:1) What are the qualifications for Hobbiest status versus Indie?
2) In your statement below, this sounds like the amount charged will actually be more than $20 an hour, because if you are paying for the hours as you go, why would there still be a balance after that?
"At which point the client will only have to pay $20 USD per man-hour and will have a set time agreed upon to pay the remaining balance. Otherwise Digital Shock will have the rights to re-sell this product to the community to mitigate its losses. "
#5
2) We will create a deal with the Client, for argument shakes lets say its $45/hr. The hobbyist rate is $20/hr with a remaining balance of $25/hr. We will give the client x number of months to pay the remaining balance, otherwise we reserve the right to re-sell the model as a content pack.
Where will this come in handy? Lets say the client has a great game idea, and wants to create a prototype project to showcase their game to a publisher. Lets say the project requires 100 man days of work. Instead of investing $36k for a prototype thats a maybe project, they can spend 16k instead. And if the project does get picked up, they can pay the remaining balance to keep full rights to it. The remaining balance is optional. You can pay it, if you want to keep full rights to it.
01/06/2010 (6:57 pm)
1) Anyone can qualify, even if you are an independent studio, you can take advantage of this program for your prototyping.2) We will create a deal with the Client, for argument shakes lets say its $45/hr. The hobbyist rate is $20/hr with a remaining balance of $25/hr. We will give the client x number of months to pay the remaining balance, otherwise we reserve the right to re-sell the model as a content pack.
Where will this come in handy? Lets say the client has a great game idea, and wants to create a prototype project to showcase their game to a publisher. Lets say the project requires 100 man days of work. Instead of investing $36k for a prototype thats a maybe project, they can spend 16k instead. And if the project does get picked up, they can pay the remaining balance to keep full rights to it. The remaining balance is optional. You can pay it, if you want to keep full rights to it.
#6
01/06/2010 (7:01 pm)
Glad you guys have a hobbyist rate. Been trying to learn 3D to make a game and I don't have the art talent to draw characters with 3D in mind. :P
#7
The remaining balance is optional? If this is not paid then...
does this mean you get full rights just to the artwork you created, or the entire Intelectual Property, and the game developed using it?
01/06/2010 (7:08 pm)
@ThanhdaThe remaining balance is optional? If this is not paid then...
does this mean you get full rights just to the artwork you created, or the entire Intelectual Property, and the game developed using it?
#8
This mean you still get full rights to this art assets except you cannot re-sell the source files. You are still allowed to use this in a commercial title etc. Digital Shock just has the rights to re-sell your model on Torque Powered Site as a Content Pack. We do not take your IP for your game.
01/06/2010 (7:13 pm)
@JohnThis mean you still get full rights to this art assets except you cannot re-sell the source files. You are still allowed to use this in a commercial title etc. Digital Shock just has the rights to re-sell your model on Torque Powered Site as a Content Pack. We do not take your IP for your game.
#9
So if we pay the additional cost, we get exclusive rights to the artwork, and we will have resell rights for the source files for this additional optional amount?
01/06/2010 (7:15 pm)
@Thanhda,So if we pay the additional cost, we get exclusive rights to the artwork, and we will have resell rights for the source files for this additional optional amount?
#10
01/06/2010 (7:17 pm)
Once you pay the remaining balance you get all exclusive rights to do whatever you want with it. We no longer bonded to the assets. So yes you get re-sell rights too.
#11
01/06/2010 (7:17 pm)
edit: Nm saw the answer to my question in the faq :) 
#12
So the "actual" rate is higher than $20 dollars an hour?
What happens if the "hobbyist" doesn't come up with the balance in time to secure "full rights"? Do they lose their entire investment?
I'm not trying to stir anything up, just want to make sure this deal is really as good as it sounds.
Thanks!
01/06/2010 (7:18 pm)
Quote:We will create a deal with the Client, for argument shakes lets say its $45/hr. The hobbyist rate is $20/hr with a remaining balance of $15/hr. We will give the client x number of months to pay the remaining balance, otherwise we reserve the right to re-sell the model as a content pack.
Quote:Instead of investing $36k for a prototype thats a maybe project, they can spend 16k instead. And if the project does get picked up, they can pay the remaining balance to keep full rights to it. The remaining balance is optional. You can pay it, if you want to keep full rights to it.
So the "actual" rate is higher than $20 dollars an hour?
What happens if the "hobbyist" doesn't come up with the balance in time to secure "full rights"? Do they lose their entire investment?
I'm not trying to stir anything up, just want to make sure this deal is really as good as it sounds.
Thanks!
#13
01/06/2010 (7:19 pm)
@KenQuote:Q. What services apply to this Hobbyist pricing?
A. Everything we offer except for concept art or illustration work. Unfortunately we can not mitigate our losses by selling concept art/illustration work on the Torque Powered store. So we pretty much only offer this discount for 3D models that need to be made from ground up. This rate will not apply for just texture work, or just modeling work.
#14
No they do not lose their investment. They still get all rights to use it and resell it in as many games as they want. But they will have to deal with other people being able to purchase the same model packs. The model packs will only be sold as indie license agreement, so no one else can use it commercially but you. They can however use it in their own prototype game.
Because this is the first phase, we will add new stipulations to it. We will most likely have an option to extend the time to pay the balance.
Lets say your game is called "Battle in Moon" and one of your characters is name "Jonny". If we were to sell this pack on the store it will be called something like "Battle in Moon - Jonny Character pack". With once again an indie license only.
01/06/2010 (7:22 pm)
@BrianNo they do not lose their investment. They still get all rights to use it and resell it in as many games as they want. But they will have to deal with other people being able to purchase the same model packs. The model packs will only be sold as indie license agreement, so no one else can use it commercially but you. They can however use it in their own prototype game.
Because this is the first phase, we will add new stipulations to it. We will most likely have an option to extend the time to pay the balance.
Lets say your game is called "Battle in Moon" and one of your characters is name "Jonny". If we were to sell this pack on the store it will be called something like "Battle in Moon - Jonny Character pack". With once again an indie license only.
#15
01/06/2010 (7:22 pm)
yeah sorry saw that answer in the faq right after i posted, must have missed that point thanks :)
#16
This sounds fair for a Hobbyist solution.
Sounds like you are really trying to provide a service that will encompass a greater number of people.
Nice job!
01/06/2010 (7:23 pm)
@Thanhda,This sounds fair for a Hobbyist solution.
Sounds like you are really trying to provide a service that will encompass a greater number of people.
Nice job!
#17
01/06/2010 (7:27 pm)
It does sound pretty good for the hobbyist. Thanks for coming up with a way to help support them as well! 
#18
01/06/2010 (7:50 pm)
Thanhda, this looks like a new very good option for low budgets, very cool! 
#19
It may help to have an approximate of time for model creation, like:
Characters (5k polys)... 30 hours
Vehicles (3k polys)..... 20 hours
Animated weapons ....... 10 hours
Static Weapons ......... 5 hours
Special effects ........ 10 hours
Something like that... that way people can get an idea of the final cost.
Luck!
Guimo
01/06/2010 (8:32 pm)
Looks like a good solution.It may help to have an approximate of time for model creation, like:
Characters (5k polys)... 30 hours
Vehicles (3k polys)..... 20 hours
Animated weapons ....... 10 hours
Static Weapons ......... 5 hours
Special effects ........ 10 hours
Something like that... that way people can get an idea of the final cost.
Luck!
Guimo
Torque Owner Kory Imaginism
innovative imaginations