Goodbye GarageGames Community
by Joshua Dallman · 01/15/2009 (2:30 am) · 59 comments
To quote GG co-founder Jeff Tunnell's blog:
"Many people have moved on, or graduated, if you will... one rarely hears from any of these people as they are running their successful companies, many still based on Torque technologies."
Speaking of developers who have moved on but are still using Torque, this is my last blog here -- this new site design settles it. It's about more than just web development decisions -- the new site design reflects the new attitude of the company, and I won't support it if it doesn't support indie games. The new IAC-funded guys running GG have amnesia when it comes to what GG was all about when it was founded. Look at the original GG logo:
See what it says right there on the logo? INDEPENDENT GAMES.
So where are the independent games and support thereof? Let's see what has GG done to support indepedent games with this new site:
(1) Removed of all the community-created games from the game store, taking it from over 50 games to less than 15
(2) Removed the community-created games "Powered by Torque" page
(3) Removed the engine-specific community-made games on the engine pages
(4) Removed all information on how to get published with GG
(5) Removed the indie game snapshots section
(6) Removed the and artist's corner snapshots section
(7) Removed game store games from the front page
(8) Buried the game store in the developer store where it'll never be found
With the lack of any new publishing of independent games except on the sparsely populated InstantAction, there's only one place left to promote any independent games I make, and that's with a developer interview that'll be up for a week and then forgotten, if I'm lucky to land the interview at all. Nice parting prize, but not nearly enough.
I've long been a champion of indie developers and their games. It seems that no one at GarageGames cares about these things anymore. On the whole site redesign team, there isn't one person with an indie perspective pulling for indies. Programmer, check. Graphic designer, check. Business analyst, check. QA, check. Actual game developer... oddly missing. Kind of funny (in a sad way) since the whole site is supposed to be designed for actual game developers.
The whole of the GarageGames community was to encourage people to make games (buy a GG engine, use the GG community, get motivated, share war stories, and get that game made, even if it was just a prototype or experiment). Where's the encouragement now when there's no place for that game to go once it's done? Where are the independent games on this site? Not even a "Powered by Torque" page or dev snapshots anymore? And the community game site "Great Games Experiment" has been totally abandoned by GG, which would have been at least some consolation as a place to put and promote games before GG expunged any evidence of their existence from this site.
On top of removing independent games from an independent game and development site, community features to support developers were an afterthought to Torque product promotion:
- no RSS
- no dev snapshot
- killed help wanted
- took out all team based interactions
- no associate tags
- no associate list
- took out all lore from the past on the company section
- no information on how to get published
- can't edit
- can't follow or be notified of blog comments and threads
- forum and resource contribution links removed from profile
- took out past work products on profile
- took out companies involved in from profile
- no profile or projects pics
- resources are a mess
- news has been eliminated
- no dashboard for what's new in community
- forums have been decimated
- no TDN
- etc.
Further participation in this once robust and thriving community is pointless. With Alexa rankings that have gone from 12,000 to 40,000 in the past year (a huge slide down), this new socially hostile site design should solidify the insignificance of continuing to participate in this declining community.
Talk is cheap -- it costs nothing to type the words "we care about the community and we're listening" (and we keep hearing that in response to this bungle). Action is what's meaningful, and by GG's actions they could care less about the community, as long as those Torque products have the best sales pages and access possible. Their only response to all this is "fixes are coming" but fixes would have been coming anyway -- they haven't reacted to our reaction at all. Hence, they aren't listening or don't truly care no matter how many times they try to spin things and type that they do. Or worse -- they're listening and they do care, but because they're not small-time developers like us anymore, they don't understand what all the fuss is about.
GG isn't dead, but the community is. Even if the community cares about GG, GG has to care about the community, and by their actions (not their words), they don't. Even if the community cares about indie games, GG has to care about indie games for there to be real support with muscle behind it, and by their actions they don't.
I'll see you guys over at http://forums.indiegamer.com. If you're serious about indie game development and community, I suggest you all level up and make the switch yourselves. If anyone has other suggestions for game dev communities to check out, post them here.
RIP GG community, 2001-2008.
Joshua Dallman
Former GarageGames Game Producer (2 years)
Indie Game Developer (5 years)
Web: http://www.redthumbgames.com
Blog: http://redthumbgames.wordpress.com/
"Many people have moved on, or graduated, if you will... one rarely hears from any of these people as they are running their successful companies, many still based on Torque technologies."
Speaking of developers who have moved on but are still using Torque, this is my last blog here -- this new site design settles it. It's about more than just web development decisions -- the new site design reflects the new attitude of the company, and I won't support it if it doesn't support indie games. The new IAC-funded guys running GG have amnesia when it comes to what GG was all about when it was founded. Look at the original GG logo:
See what it says right there on the logo? INDEPENDENT GAMES.
So where are the independent games and support thereof? Let's see what has GG done to support indepedent games with this new site:
(1) Removed of all the community-created games from the game store, taking it from over 50 games to less than 15
(2) Removed the community-created games "Powered by Torque" page
(3) Removed the engine-specific community-made games on the engine pages
(4) Removed all information on how to get published with GG
(5) Removed the indie game snapshots section
(6) Removed the and artist's corner snapshots section
(7) Removed game store games from the front page
(8) Buried the game store in the developer store where it'll never be found
With the lack of any new publishing of independent games except on the sparsely populated InstantAction, there's only one place left to promote any independent games I make, and that's with a developer interview that'll be up for a week and then forgotten, if I'm lucky to land the interview at all. Nice parting prize, but not nearly enough.
I've long been a champion of indie developers and their games. It seems that no one at GarageGames cares about these things anymore. On the whole site redesign team, there isn't one person with an indie perspective pulling for indies. Programmer, check. Graphic designer, check. Business analyst, check. QA, check. Actual game developer... oddly missing. Kind of funny (in a sad way) since the whole site is supposed to be designed for actual game developers.
The whole of the GarageGames community was to encourage people to make games (buy a GG engine, use the GG community, get motivated, share war stories, and get that game made, even if it was just a prototype or experiment). Where's the encouragement now when there's no place for that game to go once it's done? Where are the independent games on this site? Not even a "Powered by Torque" page or dev snapshots anymore? And the community game site "Great Games Experiment" has been totally abandoned by GG, which would have been at least some consolation as a place to put and promote games before GG expunged any evidence of their existence from this site.
On top of removing independent games from an independent game and development site, community features to support developers were an afterthought to Torque product promotion:
- no RSS
- no dev snapshot
- killed help wanted
- took out all team based interactions
- no associate tags
- no associate list
- took out all lore from the past on the company section
- no information on how to get published
- can't edit
- can't follow or be notified of blog comments and threads
- forum and resource contribution links removed from profile
- took out past work products on profile
- took out companies involved in from profile
- no profile or projects pics
- resources are a mess
- news has been eliminated
- no dashboard for what's new in community
- forums have been decimated
- no TDN
- etc.
Further participation in this once robust and thriving community is pointless. With Alexa rankings that have gone from 12,000 to 40,000 in the past year (a huge slide down), this new socially hostile site design should solidify the insignificance of continuing to participate in this declining community.
Talk is cheap -- it costs nothing to type the words "we care about the community and we're listening" (and we keep hearing that in response to this bungle). Action is what's meaningful, and by GG's actions they could care less about the community, as long as those Torque products have the best sales pages and access possible. Their only response to all this is "fixes are coming" but fixes would have been coming anyway -- they haven't reacted to our reaction at all. Hence, they aren't listening or don't truly care no matter how many times they try to spin things and type that they do. Or worse -- they're listening and they do care, but because they're not small-time developers like us anymore, they don't understand what all the fuss is about.
GG isn't dead, but the community is. Even if the community cares about GG, GG has to care about the community, and by their actions (not their words), they don't. Even if the community cares about indie games, GG has to care about indie games for there to be real support with muscle behind it, and by their actions they don't.
I'll see you guys over at http://forums.indiegamer.com. If you're serious about indie game development and community, I suggest you all level up and make the switch yourselves. If anyone has other suggestions for game dev communities to check out, post them here.
RIP GG community, 2001-2008.
Joshua Dallman
Former GarageGames Game Producer (2 years)
Indie Game Developer (5 years)
Web: http://www.redthumbgames.com
Blog: http://redthumbgames.wordpress.com/
About the author
#22
Good luck and I am sad to see you go :(
01/15/2009 (6:14 am)
I was poking around the new site and stumbled on TDN under support\documentation and it appears to still be in working.Good luck and I am sad to see you go :(
#23
I'm using TGE since 2002 and I learned much with TGE. Without the community, I would never came here at first.
I also feel like if I'm not part of it anymore with those new employees all around that we don't know nothing except that they say they are GG employees. GG as changed much since around 2006 because of those people and I "shut up" since 2006. I also seen a lot of other devellopers I respect "shutting up" since the same time as me. We are still here, but silently. I've seen a couples of them dropping a line because of the T3D issues and now this new "redesign", so I know I'm not alone in that boat.
I think that's why they don't know a vast majority of their costumers, working on our games, silently looking at what is happening to our gamedev website, our garage :)
It seams like they want to build a new community !? It's a weird move because building a community take years. But like everyone know, they have some $$$ to back them with the blue suit guys, so maybe they have founding for 5 to 8 years to build this new community.
I really don't "eat" that they dropped the name of the founders of GG in the "About GG" section. This is another way to show that they don't care about who build this community.
I just hope they won't change the eula for TGE because all my work is done with it. They say that they dropped TGE, so I have fears. At least, if they drop us, my hope is that they will at least leave the eulas intact for TGE, TGB and TGEA.
Nway, I'm still here for a bit ... silently :(
01/15/2009 (6:27 am)
Problem is : A lot of us can't go without dropping years of works on our games :(I'm using TGE since 2002 and I learned much with TGE. Without the community, I would never came here at first.
I also feel like if I'm not part of it anymore with those new employees all around that we don't know nothing except that they say they are GG employees. GG as changed much since around 2006 because of those people and I "shut up" since 2006. I also seen a lot of other devellopers I respect "shutting up" since the same time as me. We are still here, but silently. I've seen a couples of them dropping a line because of the T3D issues and now this new "redesign", so I know I'm not alone in that boat.
I think that's why they don't know a vast majority of their costumers, working on our games, silently looking at what is happening to our gamedev website, our garage :)
It seams like they want to build a new community !? It's a weird move because building a community take years. But like everyone know, they have some $$$ to back them with the blue suit guys, so maybe they have founding for 5 to 8 years to build this new community.
I really don't "eat" that they dropped the name of the founders of GG in the "About GG" section. This is another way to show that they don't care about who build this community.
I just hope they won't change the eula for TGE because all my work is done with it. They say that they dropped TGE, so I have fears. At least, if they drop us, my hope is that they will at least leave the eulas intact for TGE, TGB and TGEA.
Nway, I'm still here for a bit ... silently :(
#24
01/15/2009 (6:30 am)
Ok I took a second look at TDN and noticed links are broken :( 
#25
01/15/2009 (6:39 am)
I can't agree more with Joshua but I still have hope to give them sometime and improve it. I've been here for about 3 years now and have set this site as my home site since then. I've gotta say at the moment this site really looks like a cooperate site more than an indie game dev site. 
#26
On the flip side, some people have been busy working on tools for indies that can replace what's now missing, and developing a strong community based on indie participation and contributions. Check out www.indiezen.org.
01/15/2009 (6:45 am)
Sad, but not unforseen. Especially after the IA sellout.On the flip side, some people have been busy working on tools for indies that can replace what's now missing, and developing a strong community based on indie participation and contributions. Check out www.indiezen.org.
#27
Geez.
01/15/2009 (6:49 am)
Quite funny how this seems to come as a shock for many. First all the crap about that "IAC this and IAC that" won't change anything, fanboys galore, and now you're leaving a sinking ship?Geez.
#28
The community is not dead, but GG is very good in killing it bit by bit!
01/15/2009 (7:49 am)
Well... to be honest... in terms of tutorials and keeping the docs up to date GG always have been... weak... but this new site... When I first saw it I think it looked really really good... but... all most of the good stuff (or at least the part that still worked) is gone... No help what so ever and yes, I must agreed. NO REAL INDIE SUPORT!The community is not dead, but GG is very good in killing it bit by bit!
#29
I'm going to reserve judgment on the new site, and the new GG, until I hear more from the employees, and see whether there are any steps made and in what direction.
01/15/2009 (8:02 am)
I think if we require a community, we can have one. What can't you do on the net? The downside is we won't have the resource functionality, as we couldn't post source code outside the website, I assume. Still, we could use gg.com for posting our code snippets ;)I'm going to reserve judgment on the new site, and the new GG, until I hear more from the employees, and see whether there are any steps made and in what direction.
#30
While I think that you bring up some very good points about missing features or items from the GG site (which hopefully are only missing becase they are coming soon). I just wanted to comment on a few of the points you made in you post with my prespective on it.
GG & the Community
To me it feels like more effort has been put in the past year to support then community than say in the past 3 (when community support really declicned and there was a huge division between GG and the community). A lot of the people at the company have put some great effort into doing things like setting up and attending monthly chats on IRC. While I agree that certainly more can be done to be in touch with the community, I will also say that it is a daunting, mind-numbing and consuming task, so I can sometimes understand why its not done in more detail (even though I think it would rock if they could).
The Artists Corner
This section of the site never really materialized like GG hoped. Few artists cared about going this deep into the site and even fewer made an effort to post an "artists snapshot" since it rarely differed much from the IOTD. So as an artist I have to say that the loss of this 'feature' doesn't bother me in the slightest.
With regards to the game store and the rest of the site
I think GG always had to walk a really fine line of what they could promote and focus on more. Do they support the community and the game engine with the site or do they try to promote and sell games?
As much as I feel that the game industry, and indies, need good, honest and true champions to hilite the great work that they are doing I never really felt that the GG site was quite the right place to do it, since it was home to the developer community. That's really what people came here to see and that's what they expect and want.
My hope is that we will see a seperate store side to the site come up soon where games are not only sold but communities can also be built where people can talk about the great indie games that they have enjoyed. This is the kind of thing I feel that the "indies" that you are thinking of need so that they can turn themselves from that hobbyist indie to the full-time "I do this for a living" indie.
With regards to IAC
While I will agree there is a different focus going on at the company with a large publicly traded company in control of things, for the most part I have seen many of the changes that have happened since IAC as a good thing overall (yes there have been some downs/lows too but theyre outweighed). Yes it sucks that they need to focus on different things to appease the overlords and their shareholders, but like they say you need to sometimes take one step backwards to go two steps forward.
As someone who heavily relies on the tools that GG creates to help provide me with a steady income (making games), I have greatly appreciated the renewed focus at making the Torque Engines awesome. As such I continue to feel very positive overall about the direction of GarageGames and want to continue to actively use their tools in the future.
01/15/2009 (8:56 am)
@JoshWhile I think that you bring up some very good points about missing features or items from the GG site (which hopefully are only missing becase they are coming soon). I just wanted to comment on a few of the points you made in you post with my prespective on it.
GG & the Community
To me it feels like more effort has been put in the past year to support then community than say in the past 3 (when community support really declicned and there was a huge division between GG and the community). A lot of the people at the company have put some great effort into doing things like setting up and attending monthly chats on IRC. While I agree that certainly more can be done to be in touch with the community, I will also say that it is a daunting, mind-numbing and consuming task, so I can sometimes understand why its not done in more detail (even though I think it would rock if they could).
The Artists Corner
This section of the site never really materialized like GG hoped. Few artists cared about going this deep into the site and even fewer made an effort to post an "artists snapshot" since it rarely differed much from the IOTD. So as an artist I have to say that the loss of this 'feature' doesn't bother me in the slightest.
With regards to the game store and the rest of the site
I think GG always had to walk a really fine line of what they could promote and focus on more. Do they support the community and the game engine with the site or do they try to promote and sell games?
As much as I feel that the game industry, and indies, need good, honest and true champions to hilite the great work that they are doing I never really felt that the GG site was quite the right place to do it, since it was home to the developer community. That's really what people came here to see and that's what they expect and want.
My hope is that we will see a seperate store side to the site come up soon where games are not only sold but communities can also be built where people can talk about the great indie games that they have enjoyed. This is the kind of thing I feel that the "indies" that you are thinking of need so that they can turn themselves from that hobbyist indie to the full-time "I do this for a living" indie.
With regards to IAC
While I will agree there is a different focus going on at the company with a large publicly traded company in control of things, for the most part I have seen many of the changes that have happened since IAC as a good thing overall (yes there have been some downs/lows too but theyre outweighed). Yes it sucks that they need to focus on different things to appease the overlords and their shareholders, but like they say you need to sometimes take one step backwards to go two steps forward.
As someone who heavily relies on the tools that GG creates to help provide me with a steady income (making games), I have greatly appreciated the renewed focus at making the Torque Engines awesome. As such I continue to feel very positive overall about the direction of GarageGames and want to continue to actively use their tools in the future.
#31
01/15/2009 (9:12 am)
The focus for many of the community is a dream of a way to break into the business, and without a way to sell there stuff... even if it's just to the community, what's the point for the average indie? Where is our start? 
#32
To me it seems that a lot of internal changes have been taking place. I will wait and see if this is just a case of some new people coming to the scene trying to impose changes for what they think is better for the future of GG. If these changes take away from what put them there in the first place (The Indies!), then I can guarantee they will go back to more tried and true methods that put them on the map. If they don’t, or wait too long to pull their heads from the proverbial sand they might find they are too late and someone else has beaten them to this spot in the Indie market.
So to those with good business sense this corner of the market seems to be open at the moment…If I was GG I would not let anyone steal my thunder. I hope they are listening, because people here are right!! GG isn’t responding to what’s being asked, and they are not responding to the current situation.
Sorry to see you go Josh your presence here will be missed and I always enjoyed reading your Blog’s. Good luck with Shelled and all your other projects!
Bobby Leighton
Imagn’ Games and Media
01/15/2009 (9:18 am)
At some point GG will have no choice but to go Indie again if they are moving away from it at all? I agree that the way the new site has been constructed is different on the eyes, and it certainly doesn’t have the love that GG has demonstrated toward the Indies that have loved this place for so long. To me it seems that a lot of internal changes have been taking place. I will wait and see if this is just a case of some new people coming to the scene trying to impose changes for what they think is better for the future of GG. If these changes take away from what put them there in the first place (The Indies!), then I can guarantee they will go back to more tried and true methods that put them on the map. If they don’t, or wait too long to pull their heads from the proverbial sand they might find they are too late and someone else has beaten them to this spot in the Indie market.
So to those with good business sense this corner of the market seems to be open at the moment…If I was GG I would not let anyone steal my thunder. I hope they are listening, because people here are right!! GG isn’t responding to what’s being asked, and they are not responding to the current situation.
Sorry to see you go Josh your presence here will be missed and I always enjoyed reading your Blog’s. Good luck with Shelled and all your other projects!
Bobby Leighton
Imagn’ Games and Media
#33
Classy.
01/15/2009 (9:54 am)
"If you're serious about indie game development and community, I suggest you all level up and make the switch yourselves."Classy.
#34
I understand the complaints everyone has, though take a step back and look at all of the improvements to the quality of product, the work being done on engines, and even all of the blogs showing some good transparency for future development. If anything all of those things show that since the IAC buyout we've been able to improve some things very much and we are working on doing even better. Give us some time to respond to your feedback on the site, the fact that we have a completely re-built website (built in a way to allow some improvements the previous site didn't allow us) shows that we are willing to put in that much work on the web site, allow us to work on the things you are saying.
Don't jump to any conclusions here, look at the past couple years and don't jump on the bandwagon of drama. GG hasn't forgotten about Indies or our community. If we had we wouldn't have done the large amount of product releases over the last couple years, including the great improvements to docs by Michael Perry. Obviously the conspiracies surrounding the IAC buyout are not true lol, our track record the past couple years should prove this :) Maybe some things could've gone differently with this web launch, give us some time to respond to all this feedback though.
01/15/2009 (10:25 am)
I guess more engine releases since the IAC buyout doesn't count as supporting Indies now? As well as the new blog line Brett has started that's not only explaining what we're working on it, but involving the community into some of the planning discussions, that doesn't count either? TGEA reaching a more stable and polished state than ever before and even winning a Front Line Engine award, that's us moving away from helping Indies too I suppose?I understand the complaints everyone has, though take a step back and look at all of the improvements to the quality of product, the work being done on engines, and even all of the blogs showing some good transparency for future development. If anything all of those things show that since the IAC buyout we've been able to improve some things very much and we are working on doing even better. Give us some time to respond to your feedback on the site, the fact that we have a completely re-built website (built in a way to allow some improvements the previous site didn't allow us) shows that we are willing to put in that much work on the web site, allow us to work on the things you are saying.
Don't jump to any conclusions here, look at the past couple years and don't jump on the bandwagon of drama. GG hasn't forgotten about Indies or our community. If we had we wouldn't have done the large amount of product releases over the last couple years, including the great improvements to docs by Michael Perry. Obviously the conspiracies surrounding the IAC buyout are not true lol, our track record the past couple years should prove this :) Maybe some things could've gone differently with this web launch, give us some time to respond to all this feedback though.
#35
100% of your missing feature list goes into the "its not done yet, duh" category. As for the game store / indy game related changes ... maybe those will end up reappearing too, but even if they don't, so what?
The quality of game that gets into the store here needed to seriously be increased. I'm sure they wouldn't permanently remove anything that was actually selling, and I'm also pretty sure a lot of those [b]were not[b].
Besides, what if they decided to completely remove the game store, so what? Torque games have been published on big fish, steam, etc... its not like this is the most trafficked online store on the internet.
01/15/2009 (10:26 am)
So the site has issues and is missing old features on the day after it goes live, could it just maybe be a little early for extreme sweeping judgments?100% of your missing feature list goes into the "its not done yet, duh" category. As for the game store / indy game related changes ... maybe those will end up reappearing too, but even if they don't, so what?
The quality of game that gets into the store here needed to seriously be increased. I'm sure they wouldn't permanently remove anything that was actually selling, and I'm also pretty sure a lot of those [b]were not[b].
Besides, what if they decided to completely remove the game store, so what? Torque games have been published on big fish, steam, etc... its not like this is the most trafficked online store on the internet.
#36
1)He has the appropriate emails at Garage Games. He could have emailed his concerns directly and maybe worked constructively in the aid of the community, Instead of just freaking out.
2)So GarageGames has decided to move away from being a half-assed publisher. Who cares? maybe that extra energy can be put toward making better tech, compiling better documentation. Actually helping people create games that could be published anywhere, not just in an always hidden always ugly game store. Don't complain because the site removed something you used to try and do, and didn't do very well.
This is just a lame attempt to be cool and "stick it to the man" instead of investing the the community that needs a little direction right about now. There is nothing in his post that could not be switched around into some sort of super helpful document for all of tech and tools at GG. Instead he is turning his back on a community that for some reason has supported him for so long.
shame.
01/15/2009 (11:24 am)
I will say I am unhappy about the new site design as well. But I trust the people working on it to actually take the community's feedback and make changes as necessary. As for the post itself I think it is misguided. 1)He has the appropriate emails at Garage Games. He could have emailed his concerns directly and maybe worked constructively in the aid of the community, Instead of just freaking out.
2)So GarageGames has decided to move away from being a half-assed publisher. Who cares? maybe that extra energy can be put toward making better tech, compiling better documentation. Actually helping people create games that could be published anywhere, not just in an always hidden always ugly game store. Don't complain because the site removed something you used to try and do, and didn't do very well.
This is just a lame attempt to be cool and "stick it to the man" instead of investing the the community that needs a little direction right about now. There is nothing in his post that could not be switched around into some sort of super helpful document for all of tech and tools at GG. Instead he is turning his back on a community that for some reason has supported him for so long.
shame.
#37
If you at GG (or should I say IAC)really cared all that much about us, given the huge responses we've given you in Brett's blog's posts as of recent, you would have thought that someone of a position of power would have taken a step back and said, "We'd better make sure that when we release the updated site it's already 98% polished to show that we mean what we say and that we still do care about our Indies and current community, otherwise they may take it as us trying to push them out".
Instead of just bandaiding the site as you go to "show" that you still care...
But o-wait you are trying to get rid of us "dreamers"...
Sid.
01/15/2009 (11:43 am)
I totally agree with Joshua and the others that feel what he's feeling and here's why.If you at GG (or should I say IAC)really cared all that much about us, given the huge responses we've given you in Brett's blog's posts as of recent, you would have thought that someone of a position of power would have taken a step back and said, "We'd better make sure that when we release the updated site it's already 98% polished to show that we mean what we say and that we still do care about our Indies and current community, otherwise they may take it as us trying to push them out".
Instead of just bandaiding the site as you go to "show" that you still care...
But o-wait you are trying to get rid of us "dreamers"...
Sid.
#38
Annnnnyways...
Thanks for the support, those of you who are supporting us. It means a lot to us.
Also, thank you everyone who is holding out on judging us *too* harshly this early in the launch of the new site. We're listening and working on your suggestions and bugs. You'll see!
I'm going to go back to work now with Jacob on fixing the bugs that people are constructively submitting. We've already gotten several of your suggestions implemented for the next push.
Hi Mark!
01/15/2009 (11:44 am)
Using terms like defecating on the community? Really, how mature. Sigh...Annnnnyways...
Thanks for the support, those of you who are supporting us. It means a lot to us.
Also, thank you everyone who is holding out on judging us *too* harshly this early in the launch of the new site. We're listening and working on your suggestions and bugs. You'll see!
I'm going to go back to work now with Jacob on fixing the bugs that people are constructively submitting. We've already gotten several of your suggestions implemented for the next push.
Hi Mark!
#39
Why should we- the people who supported GG be free bug testers for a system that at one time worked? If any of you bought a new art program only to find it unusable because of bugs, would you stick with it because of a promise that everything will be fixed at sometime?
Of course as soon as they fix the upgrade price for TGEA, i am going to upgrade, as this last 2 months i have spent my time getting my TGE project ready for the switch. I still love how simple the 3D engines are to work with.
01/15/2009 (12:11 pm)
The reason i decided on the Torque engine was not for any of its functions, but for how easy it was to get information from the rest of the Torque community. I can now hardly reach that information, and reading black text on white background is in itself a difficult task. I dont like being a bug tester for something that was once a great research tool. In my line of work if a tool is not easy and fast i find another tool that will fit my needs. This new website is not an easy tool to use, and clicking around to find information is no longer fast. Why should we- the people who supported GG be free bug testers for a system that at one time worked? If any of you bought a new art program only to find it unusable because of bugs, would you stick with it because of a promise that everything will be fixed at sometime?
Of course as soon as they fix the upgrade price for TGEA, i am going to upgrade, as this last 2 months i have spent my time getting my TGE project ready for the switch. I still love how simple the 3D engines are to work with.
#40
01/15/2009 (12:11 pm)
You made me miss the blog rating system. :)
Torque Owner James Laker (BurNinG)
And it's not that the staff at GG is not working hard. My hat goes off to them all.
The end response will be that GG needs to make more money to give better support the indie. The problem in the end is not to loose focus of what you're really trying to accomplish - Helping Indies and the guy on the street.