Let's Play Name that Engine

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Justin Kovac   (May 03, 2006 at 04:45 GMT)

Wow Alan, this is very impressive! In all honesty the second picture made me instantly think it was the CryEngine (FarCry's engine), then I thought it was TSE after seeing the terrain on the picture after that. Amazing work for TGE, keep up the great work guys!

Brandon Maness   (May 03, 2006 at 04:45 GMT)

I agree with you, those 4 resources really make TGE shine. Great looking levels BTW!

Josh Moore   (May 03, 2006 at 04:48 GMT)

Great looking stuff. I'm gonna try out that water update and DRL stuff myself pretty soon. ;)

Alex Scarborough   (May 03, 2006 at 05:03 GMT)

I like that third picture. A lot. In fact, words cannot describe how much I love that picture. It'll be one of those pictures that inspires me to keep plugging away at getting the full GLSL resource out.

Tek0   (May 03, 2006 at 05:08 GMT)

@Alan James

With the TGE w/ Bumpmapped Interiors (using the CG runtime) resource, the last time I used the resource on a ATI card, all the buildings was purple. Has anyone got that fixed?

But besides that, those screenshots look great!
Edited on May 03, 2006 05:11 GMT

Ian Roach   (May 03, 2006 at 05:14 GMT)

This is amazing looking stuff, i cant wait till we implement these into our game.

Now we just need more water in our levels to showoff the cool effects :)

Andrew Hull   (May 03, 2006 at 05:59 GMT)

Oh my.... holy.... WOW. That is absolutely amazing. This is going to be a game i expect to see on Walmart/CompUSA/Gamestop shelves.

Hokuto   (May 03, 2006 at 06:16 GMT)

Great stuff! Top resources.
GG can we make all the above come standard with GG now?

:)

Alan James   (May 03, 2006 at 06:45 GMT)

@Stephen

Right now I don't have a system with an ATI card in it to try it out, but honestly I had the exact same problem with my first couple (of dozen) attempts to get the resource into 1.4 on a Nvidia 7300GS. I ran WinMerge back and forth so many times for nearly a week, I was about ready to give up. I might have my old system up with a ATI card in it soon, so I'll let you know if I have any luck -- or not! =P

BTW, do you have TLK? If you do, I was considering posting my .cc and .h files in the TLK private forums for these resources. The reason being some of the TLK code would be exposed, and so I'd only be able to offer it in those forums because you'd have to be a TLK owner. Let me know, and I'll try to confirm with John Kabus that that route would be acceptable.

- Alan

Blake Lowry   (May 03, 2006 at 07:28 GMT)

This looks really nice! What are your computer specs and what kind of performance are you getting?

John Kabus (BobTheCBuilder)   (May 03, 2006 at 07:30 GMT)

Hey Alan, looking great as always! :)

No problem, in fact you can create a resource and then send me the link before it's approved. I'll make sure GG flags it as a TLK private resource and all should be good. We have a number of TLK resources available (like the awesome DRL/Bloom resource!) and it seems to work out really well.
Edited on May 03, 2006 07:31 GMT

Alex Scarborough   (May 03, 2006 at 07:53 GMT)

@Blake: I've got the same set of resources going (though my DRL has been optimized a fair amount now), and on a Mac G4 1.42 Ghz with a Radeon 9600, I pull about 10FPS using the standard starter.fps with everything going. With some of the more advanced DRL features turned off, it gets up around 14 FPS. If water isn't in view, the numbers are 15FPS to 25FPS. If the camera is in an interior, 30 FPS to 50 FPS.

@Stephen: I should be getting out a GLSL version of the interior bumpmap resource within the week. It works just fine on ATi cards (and doesn't kill the lightmaps, yay!)

Clint S. Brewer   (May 03, 2006 at 08:10 GMT)

@Alan, really looking great,

"if I can stay away from coding and start building some real content."

don't feel bad, ever so often you have to spend time on the pretty graphics to make you feel better about the game in this crazy kooky world, now get back to the game play content and you will feel 10 times as good :)

More than the resources though it shows how great your art/ artists are.


@Alex: are those fps running under a debug build or release? seems pretty slow for the setup you have.

Bardur Mikladal   (May 03, 2006 at 09:49 GMT)

INSANE!... i was looking for that water resource (i saw it a while back... when it wasnt released) and i searched like a MadMan but ijust couldnt find it.... But now... heeh Now i have the cool stuff of the universe!
im going to add these recources to my "Labratoria" game (experimental game) :)

BTW.. LOVE the images! looks very much like the CryEngine.. now we just need SSS in game (sub surface scattering) hehehe :)

Regards
Bardur
Edited on May 03, 2006 09:56 GMT

N R Bharathae   (May 03, 2006 at 10:47 GMT)

Incredible! you guys are giving TSE a run for its money. Keep up the great work!

Mark Berry   (May 03, 2006 at 11:22 GMT)

Fantastic progress. Like others I saw the screenies and thought it was tse.

Adam deGrandis   (May 03, 2006 at 12:42 GMT)

This is looking super sharp, guys. :)

Tek0   (May 03, 2006 at 12:53 GMT)

@Alan James

Yes I do own TLK, that would be great if you can post the source files or make a new resource.

Matt Vitelli   (May 03, 2006 at 13:57 GMT)

Amazing work, Alan. Did you manage to fix the purple problem with the bump mapping resource?

Alan Hembra   (May 03, 2006 at 14:21 GMT)   Resource Rating: 5

Oh man. Very, very nice and professional looking. My eyes are in eyes candy heaven!

I remember when you started Alan. You are a serious inspiration!
Edited on May 03, 2006 14:22 GMT

Alan Hembra   (May 03, 2006 at 14:24 GMT)   Resource Rating: 5

@ Alan - I forgot to ask, are you using a level builder or any 3rd party programs to create your levels?

Alexander "taualex" Gaevoy   (May 03, 2006 at 15:24 GMT)   Resource Rating: 5

Dang! Water! - that's all I need to create the Oblivion clone! ;)

Anyway, Alan - good job, man

Tom Perry   (May 03, 2006 at 16:17 GMT)

Wow, thats awesome. Great work!

Alan James   (May 03, 2006 at 16:42 GMT)

Ok, thanks everyone...here come all the @'s

@John K. (and Stephen) Sounds like a plan, I'll try to post a resource on Thursday (that's my day off from the real world). And thanks again for all your help.

@Blake L. My numbers are similar to Alex's, allthough I think I'm doing a bit better on the outdoor scenes with everything turned on, only chug under 20fps if I have a lot of foliage and stuff in view, but with some culling tweaking it hangs 25-35 fps, and my interiors are 35-55fps (again with everything turned on).
3.2ghz P4 H/T, 768mb ram, BFG 7300GS 256mb

@Matt V. Yes, I have it working right, but like I noted to Stephen above, not sure what will happen on an ATI card. Alex's Torque Modernization Kit (aka GLSL integrated for Torque) will no doubt be a much better option than my hack, but I'll still post it as a TLK private resource, so watch those forums.

@Alan H. Nothing for the open area levels, interiors I use 3D World Studio (version 5.43, 'cause 5.44 & 5.45 are broken in regards towards Torque/Map2Dif Plus...at least they were up to a week ago, haven't checked the forums over at www.leadwerks.com lately).

@Alex S. Have a question for you, can the original DRL 1.0 be modified so the brightness/contrast of the scene adjusting updates properly with the TGE Water Resource? I know it sounds weird but I kind of like the control that was available with the original resource. With 2.0 I seem to be fighting the lighting quite a bit more than I did originally, even with locking the setDRLSkipTime and/or setChangeRates. No big deal, and I'm sure I can figure out what settings work best, just a thought. (BTW, loading the setDRLSkipTime and/or setChangeRates seems to be erratic in the .mis files. It's in the "new ScriptObject(MissionInfo)" is that where I should be loading it from, right?

Anyways, I can always take a look at what I've done before:



Thanks again to everyone for the encouragement,

- Alan
Really Really Good Things Studio
Edited on May 03, 2006 16:43 GMT

Tim Hutcheson   (May 03, 2006 at 16:50 GMT)

Really Really Good Work Alan.

Nice to see how you maintain complete working directory trees of all the progress so that you can WinMerge against earlier versions at all times. Wonder how many others do it this way? It's amazing how quickly the good work can slip away unless you do this. I'd rather buy another hard drive than delete one of those folders.

Jeff "Reno" Raab   (May 03, 2006 at 16:52 GMT)

Daaaang, thems some smexy shots : D
Though remember, this stuff doesnt make you a poor man's TSE, it's just some very select stuff written to run the shaders in specific spots
Eitherway, the results are fantastic, and i cant wait to see more.

Alan James   (May 03, 2006 at 17:01 GMT)

@Jeff,

Yep that's a big ten four on the gulf between TGE and TSE, own both but I'm in *WAY* to deep to port over "Code Name: Monster Island" to TSE (and certain things I need won't be ready for a while), so I figured I'd make the transition smoother when the sequel "Return to Monster Island" comes out on TSE. Which of course preceeds "Monster Planet" for XBox 360... =P

@Tim Hutcheson

Yeah, my take on back up directories is similar to what I tell my kids about taking a coat with you. You can take it off if you don't need it, but you can't put it on if you don't have it. But that's just dad talk.


- Alan
Edited on May 03, 2006 17:13 GMT

Timothy Aste   (May 03, 2006 at 17:18 GMT)

Wow!

Alexander "taualex" Gaevoy   (May 03, 2006 at 17:37 GMT)   Resource Rating: 5

@Alan J.: you have a good video card, and the framerates you got are suspiciosly low... do you have a lot of triangles/faces or huge textures in your scene? Is it post-processing of the video buffer of the whole screen?

Mine x800GTO/256Mb renders similar or more complex scenes with 70+ fps (based on Far Cry/Quake/Oblivion)... Obviously, the water/bump shaders are not running in software, so they shouldnt be a performance hit... A huge volume of shadered water from Ogre3D demo runs at 80+ fps on the same video card.

Alan James   (May 03, 2006 at 18:04 GMT)

@Alex G

At this point *Nothing* has been optimized for gameplay. I still have some texture files as high as 1024x1024, view distances are set *Way* out, no fog, culling on foliage replication hasn't been optimized, etc., etc...
Yeah I've messed with the OGRE demo & the SDK. With this resource in Torque, if I go and stand looking only at the water my framerates run in this range:



Can't speak for the other games what kind of difference there would be/is. My son has Oblivion, but we haven't tried it on my system since the new video card.

But I do know I've got tons of optimization to go...but that's how it goes... =)

- Alan

Alexander "taualex" Gaevoy   (May 03, 2006 at 18:29 GMT)   Resource Rating: 5

@Alan J.: As I can see, it goes pretty well! :) I see now why you had low framerates. Good luck with your projec! You have a customer already ;)


BTW, do you need a tester? I would like to test your demo on various video cards including Intel Extream 900/950 chipsets (as very used because of Dell).
Edited on May 03, 2006 18:33 GMT

Tom Bentz   (May 03, 2006 at 18:59 GMT)

that is amazing....

bank   (May 03, 2006 at 19:40 GMT)   Resource Rating: 5

Alan, what is the settings of sky in mission on you last screen (visibleDistance and fogDistance)?

yeah, TGE+TLK+enhancements are great stuff!
since first release of DLR I can't find time to play with it... hope today/tomorrow I can take my hands on that.. ;)

Anthony Fullmer   (May 03, 2006 at 21:22 GMT)

Wow, very impressive screens, people have done an awesome job modifying TGE !

Hokuto   (May 03, 2006 at 21:41 GMT)

if all of it (including game logic) can run at a decent frame rate.... WOW!

Alex Scarborough   (May 03, 2006 at 22:53 GMT)

@Alan - The fix in the DRL2.0 resource comments works with the original release as well. Also, just a bit of advice, you can set the skip time and change rate the same way everything else is set in the DRL2.0 integration tutorial. And if you call setOverexposureIntercept(0.0); and setUnderexposureWhiteOffset(0.0); in DRL2.0, it becomes essentially the same as DRL1.0 in terms of feature set, except with all of the nice bug fixes.

@Clint - Those FPS numbers are from release. Couple of things to keep in mind: My 9600 is pretty watered down. I don't have exact numbers on it yet, but suffice it to say that a lot of stuff has been cut out. Also, I tend to not reboot for long periods of time and have a ton of apps open.

Alienforce   (May 03, 2006 at 23:44 GMT)

Does the CG bump thingy work with TGE 1.4 ????

Alex Scarborough   (May 03, 2006 at 23:47 GMT)

@Alienforce - You have to hand merge it, which is a bit of a pain since not quite all of the changes are marked, and it has issues on ATi cards, but yes, it does work with TGE 1.4. The GLSL port will come integrated into 1.4, with all changes marked.

Alienforce   (May 03, 2006 at 23:55 GMT)

thanks for your reply Alex.
Great! Time to do some merging then. BTW: Whats the timeframe for the GLSL port ??

Alex Scarborough   (May 04, 2006 at 00:01 GMT)

@Alienforce - The TGE version is in final testing now. The TLK version needs just a little bit of tweaking and some more testing and it should be good to go.
Edited on May 04, 2006 03:04 GMT

Alan James   (May 04, 2006 at 00:48 GMT)

@Alex
Hey thanks, really mean it. I know I sound like Pooh Bear ("a bear of very little learning"), but I had such a cool handle on DRL 1.0 that it's taking a bit for my brain to get around 2.0. I see what you mean there, so when I get home from work I'll give 'er another go! =P
Thanks,

-Alan

Vin \"japo\" Polston   (May 04, 2006 at 02:08 GMT)

wow very impressive. any chance we could get a demo with these levels? I want to test it on my system.
AMD Athlon 64 3500+
1 GB DDR3200 (2,3,2,5)
ATI Radeon x850 XT 256mb PCI-E
just want to see framerates, could report them if u want.

Alan James   (May 04, 2006 at 04:02 GMT)

@Vin

Not immediately, but I'm working towards a two level beta 2 release in early summer, more than likely the end of June. I wish I could do it sooner, but I've been swamped with details on the game, and I'd really like to have most of the functional aspects done by then so I can finish content over the next three or so months.

I really don't think I'll hit my IGC release deadline, but it will be pretty darn close and "Code Name: Monster Island" will be crazy better than IGC 2005's build.

- Alan

Alan James   (May 04, 2006 at 05:06 GMT)

@bank,

sorry, almost forgot to reply. visible distance 550, fog distance 380. Wanted that one just far enough from the small island to see the entire coastland.

- Alan

Ajari Wilson   (May 04, 2006 at 13:49 GMT)

Wow. I had no idea that was TGE. I had no idea TGE was capable of that. Alan I had no idea you guys were capable of that. I'm always amazed by your screenshots because the improvements are always so drastic from the last ones. I can't wait to get another beta.
-Ajari-

Alienforce   (May 04, 2006 at 16:11 GMT)

Is there any good addon for enhance the player charcters also ??

Simon Benge   (May 04, 2006 at 17:24 GMT)

cheeky blighter! Thats my SAS dude and colt commando from FPS Creator....put it back :)
Available from www.fpscreator.com/index.php?id=43 BTW

Alan James   (May 04, 2006 at 17:47 GMT)

@Simon

awww...come on...it was hard enough getting him to play nice in Torque...=) ...well, not really that hard...
Which reminds me it's payday and I was going to get the Animated sprite pack...

- Alan
Edited on May 04, 2006 18:21 GMT

Aaron Ellis   (May 04, 2006 at 19:54 GMT)

@Alan J.

CN:MI is looking better than ever. I want to thank you for alerting us to the new TGE water update. I didn't even know about it until this .Plan. Very cool stuff.

Keep up the good work.

Alan Hembra   (May 04, 2006 at 20:10 GMT)   Resource Rating: 5

@Simon Benge - thanks for reminding me to go back and download the model pack! I forgot!

kingkong   (May 05, 2006 at 18:57 GMT)   Resource Rating: 5

WOW!!! Amzing resouce!!!
thanks for your great resource.

Alienforce   (May 08, 2006 at 10:10 GMT)

Any news on the "GLSL port " ??

Guimo   (May 10, 2006 at 23:31 GMT)

Alan,
I was looking for a game engine in rder to replace mine and was evaluating many options. I really had my doubts about the TGE overall quality but you have helped me to take my decision.

I would wish you luck in you project but you already have 'quality'.... don't need luck.

I really owe you one.
Guimo

David Menefee   (May 20, 2006 at 17:40 GMT)

Hey Alex

I hate to bug you, but I'm curious: how's it going? Need any help testing the modernization kit? :) I'm sure I speak for the other Mac-o-philes when I say "thank you" for your work on the TGE GLSL port!

Rgds,
Dave

Alienforce   (May 31, 2006 at 00:08 GMT)

Any news ??

Nick Thompson   (Jul 12, 2006 at 05:32 GMT)

Alan Hit me up when you got a demo send it to me i'll try it out maybe we could meet up and play against each other would be fun you know it!

Alan James   (Jul 14, 2006 at 08:17 GMT)

@Nick,

No problem, demo won't be for a couple months, but I'll let you know. I'll try to get an email off to you tomorrow if I can!

-Alan

Alan James   (Aug 04, 2006 at 02:12 GMT)

*TEST*

Edited on Aug 04, 2006 02:13 GMT

Alexander "taualex" Gaevoy   (Aug 04, 2006 at 05:07 GMT)   Resource Rating: 5

Lokks good. Any chance to see them bigger? :P

Matt Vitelli   (Aug 06, 2006 at 23:07 GMT)

Alan, do you use any IM clients? If you don't mind I'd really like to ask some questions.

Noah Gomes   (Jan 08, 2007 at 20:34 GMT)

Hey, are you still working on this game? If you are, what version are you using

Alan James   (Jan 15, 2007 at 21:11 GMT)

Hey Noah, missed your post last week. Sorry. Yes, still working on this, I'm using version 1.4. I've integrated a build with Alex Scarborough's GLSL port and I haven't been successful in going any higher in the TGE releases. You can see new screenshots at:

www.reallyreallygoodthings.com

Hope to finish this this year (along with a couple smaller games we're working on).

Noah Gomes   (Mar 14, 2007 at 07:06 GMT)

Alan. I can't get the water to mirror. Do I need the light kit

Alan James   (Mar 14, 2007 at 13:18 GMT)

Hey Noah, you shouldn't need the lighting kit, what version of Torque are you using (1.4, 1.42)? If you're using 1.5, your best bet is to use Alex S.'s Modernization Kit Beta that can be found here:

www.garagegames.com/mg/forums/result.thread.php?qt=58532

Noah Gomes   (Mar 14, 2007 at 19:00 GMT)

now I'm using 4.2
I took six months off from torque

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